Finally we bring to you an interview that has been YEARS in the making! Enjoy our chat about all things Rapp and thrillers with Ryan Steck!
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00:00:11
Hey guys, I'm Chris and I'm Mike, welcome back to this
00:00:16
week's No Limits. The Mitch rap podcast.
00:00:19
Well, what's new this week? Mike.
00:00:22
Hey, I am just excited to announce our guest today.
00:00:26
Wasn't that a great conversation we had earlier in the week.
00:00:30
Yes, it was just it was we have a titillating guest for you
00:00:34
today. One.
00:00:36
We've been trying to get on this podcast for a long time, but
00:00:38
he's been busy years. He's a he's a busy man.
00:00:42
And you know what? It didn't disappoint.
00:00:43
It was a great interview. So much.
00:00:46
So we're gonna have to have them all on a couple more times.
00:00:48
Just to complete this interview there can easily be a part two,
00:00:52
a three, four five, who knows? Because man the way we were
00:00:56
going, especially once we got into the Mitch rap stuff, these
00:01:00
moments we liked these the arcs in the series that we like the
00:01:04
characters we could have went for hours.
00:01:06
Just talking about my trap. Yeah.
00:01:09
And so, as you guys know from the intro, this is being dropped
00:01:13
on the mid trap odd because we are discussing amid trap.
00:01:16
But before we get into this interview, I just want to give
00:01:19
you me and Mike wanted to give you a little bit update on all
00:01:22
were doing with no limits. So not only do we have this pot,
00:01:26
we just covered both of loyalty culminating with an awesome
00:01:30
interview with Kyle Mills, great book to go get that.
00:01:33
If you haven't read that, I don't know what rock you been
00:01:35
under under for the past month. You know, it's almost Halloween
00:01:40
it damn near when this comes out it will be Halloween.
00:01:43
So you should read that book anyways on season 2, we are
00:01:49
going strong with probably Should I say our favorite book?
00:01:54
Maybe hot take. I don't know, take down this
00:01:57
month. We put up part one where part 2
00:02:00
will be coming out to you soon. What an awesome book Mike.
00:02:04
I love take down. Yeah, I'm glad we're getting
00:02:07
back to the Scott Horvath pod. We're trying to do one breadth
00:02:11
or book a month and the last few maybe we were in a little bit of
00:02:16
a rut, but take down. Let me tell you, this one comes
00:02:19
out swinging. When we record that that second
00:02:22
part, this is going to be up there with lions of Lucerne.
00:02:26
We'll see if it can Eclipse it, I'm not sure.
00:02:28
But yeah, we are full steam ahead with Scott Harvest, and
00:02:32
the breadth or books over on season 2 and no limits.
00:02:35
If that wasn't enough for you, we have a third pot haven't
00:02:39
heard of it. No limits the throw their
00:02:41
podcast, where we talk about. Everything that's not Scott,
00:02:44
harv app or Metro app called Mills, whatever.
00:02:48
And let me just tell you what we've covered.
00:02:49
So far on that feet all of the Chris howdy books.
00:02:54
A lot of the Jack car books, almost all other Jack car.
00:02:58
I'm Jack our books where we got. We have think we have two left,
00:03:00
right? We also did The Gray, Man, Mark,
00:03:03
rainy and the movie and we we might even dabble in a little
00:03:07
bit of Gabriel Lon. Yes, Daniel Silva.
00:03:12
So also the True Believer if we get season 2 of the terminal
00:03:17
list announced will be live on that podcast.
00:03:20
Definitely digging into all the gossip around that show and we
00:03:23
just cover True Believer the book it would come True
00:03:26
Believer. We covered all of the terminal
00:03:28
list. Mike did an awesome job bringing
00:03:30
on multiple guests break that down.
00:03:33
We had an interview with Jack. And next week.
00:03:36
Yes. Andrews.
00:03:37
And we'll sell him. Oh dude.
00:03:39
Yeah. Perhaps two of my favorite
00:03:41
authors, who are? This is crazy to author's,
00:03:44
writing a series together. The Tier 1 series is just super
00:03:49
badass and they've also released their second book in the sons of
00:03:54
Valor series, man chunk, he's such an operator, absolutely
00:03:58
love in that book and then the shepherd series which is so
00:04:03
unique. Chris, you haven't gotten into
00:04:05
To the shepherd series yet, have you?
00:04:06
No, I have not. Okay, dude, it is.
00:04:10
One of my favorites, their debut book dark intercept and that
00:04:14
series. It's up there man, like it's up
00:04:18
there with terminal list as a debut and term limits as a
00:04:20
debut. It's so unique, it's so
00:04:23
different. I can't even decide e of
00:04:26
spiritual warfare and it's insane to think of that in a
00:04:29
military-style thriller but they pull it off.
00:04:31
So next week, we're going to have them on talking about their
00:04:34
newest release. It's Darkfall the third book in
00:04:37
the shepherd series. You do not want to miss Andrews
00:04:40
and Wilson. And I guess we could just say it
00:04:43
right here. You know, if you like what
00:04:45
you're hearing for less than the price of a novel a month, you
00:04:48
can help support No Limits. We should say thank you to our
00:04:52
patrons. In our first year, we were able
00:04:54
to do an amazing five hundred dollar donation to The Prostate
00:04:57
Cancer Foundation in Vince's memory, which was amazing and we
00:05:03
continue going with operation paperback to tell them all about
00:05:06
operation paperback, Mike. Chris I'm having a blast
00:05:10
partnering with Operation paperback.
00:05:13
It felt real great making the donation to The Prostate Cancer
00:05:16
Foundation and I feel like the work we're doing with operation
00:05:19
paperback is just as meaningful, if not more, they're an
00:05:23
organization. A nonprofit that enlists
00:05:26
volunteers to send care packages of books and magazines and
00:05:30
literature to to active duty troops as well as veterans and
00:05:34
Veterans, homes and hospitals. So far, just this month, we've
00:05:39
sent 30 books into care packages to veterans hospitals, and that
00:05:43
puts our two-year total as a thriller podcast community over
00:05:48
1 books sent in over 50, different care packages and a
00:05:54
few of those were to active duty bases around the world.
00:05:58
So hopefully we're making a big impact getting books out there.
00:06:02
And I will say Chris, a majority of those books.
00:06:05
I can honestly say have been Vince Flynn now.
00:06:07
All's, I've prioritized making sure a lot of insulin novels get
00:06:11
into those care packages, so, that's awesome.
00:06:14
Share the wealth. You can join us and become a
00:06:17
patron and help us continue to send out these monthly care
00:06:20
packages and collect thriller books.
00:06:23
Just visit Thriller pod.com, click, the orange support us on
00:06:27
patreon button, you will get bookmarks stickers, a coupon
00:06:33
code in our gear store. So you can get you your hoodie
00:06:37
Sure, tetrapod gear every penny will help support the podcast
00:06:41
and the profits will go towards continuing to send out care
00:06:44
packages to our troops and our veterans.
00:06:48
I guess on that note, we should shout out our newest Patron.
00:06:51
Yeah. Welcome welcome.
00:06:53
Yeah. Rod has joined us since we
00:06:55
recorded and we missed a few in there because we had them
00:06:58
pre-recorded, but welcome Rod. G, you were not only a guest
00:07:02
many, many episodes ago. Talking about Kyle Mills.
00:07:05
You are his gun Guru and his gun.
00:07:07
Advisor. But now you are a patron of the
00:07:10
podcast. You're part of the reason.
00:07:11
We can keep this podcast coming at you weekly.
00:07:14
Welcome run. Thank you very much for your
00:07:16
support. So yeah, we're just cranking out
00:07:19
content for you, you know what better than to give you more
00:07:23
content than give you a giveaway.
00:07:25
What do you think we should? We give them a giveaway for this
00:07:27
special interview. We haven't even told him who
00:07:29
it's going to be but we have a special giveaway.
00:07:31
Yeah, so this this interview today Chris I think you and I
00:07:35
both said when we started this podcast smack in the middle of
00:07:39
the pandemic 2020 at its worst. We said two things would be
00:07:43
great. If they can happen one, we get
00:07:45
Kyle Mills on the pod. To we get Ryan, stick the rap,
00:07:50
ologist on the Pod, and today we make that dream a reality.
00:07:55
And so to celebrate, we want you guys are listeners involved.
00:07:59
We wouldn't be here without you. So we are giving away two copies
00:08:03
of fields of fire. We're going to see if we can
00:08:06
bother Ryan enough to get him to autograph, these copies will pay
00:08:10
for the shipping Ryan. So we got you covered.
00:08:13
So possibly to autographed copies of fields of fire and
00:08:16
there are More ways to enter first.
00:08:19
You have to be subscribed to all three of our podcast feeds.
00:08:22
And then for each one of these entries.
00:08:24
On our social media, you will get an entry into the giveaway.
00:08:28
So, for chances to win first by leaving a review in the Apple
00:08:33
podcast app. We hope it's five stars.
00:08:36
But if you write up a little comment, put your screen name or
00:08:38
username in there, how we can contact you?
00:08:41
That's one entry. If you retweet, our official
00:08:44
tweet promoting this episode once, We publish this episode,
00:08:48
go ahead and retweet and share that same on Instagram.
00:08:51
If you share our story, the official story, where we're
00:08:53
publishing this episode. And if you join on Facebook, the
00:08:57
No Limits group and share our post, where we'll be making our
00:09:00
official post of this episode. So, for ways, for social media
00:09:05
platforms, if you help share the Pod, we will put your name into
00:09:09
the pot to win a copy of fields of fire.
00:09:11
And dude, speaking of Debut book, Riot very good come.
00:09:14
He comes on strong with his first Maddie red.
00:09:17
I think Maddie ready a household name in The Thrill of hers.
00:09:21
Yeah, and it's funny, we barely got a chance to, I guess because
00:09:25
we had when want to talk to him for a long time and we finally
00:09:28
got him on, you know, in this culminating with what this is,
00:09:33
our episode 112 of our maitreya pod, so that many hours of
00:09:37
content that we wanted to discuss with him.
00:09:39
So at the very end, obviously we had to talk about his book and
00:09:43
sprinkled throughout he mentions it.
00:09:44
So definitely go out there. Get your copy of people to fire.
00:09:48
He's already working on the second one.
00:09:50
Yeah, it really good day by day debut book and hopefully we have
00:09:54
a chance to you know, talk about this more either definitely
00:09:57
between the two of us but hopefully we can bring Ryan back
00:09:59
on to talk a little bit more about it.
00:10:02
Absolutely, and the way he's talking about lethal range.
00:10:06
The second book, the sequel men. I'm jazzed about that, too.
00:10:10
So you'll hear that in the interview.
00:10:12
Join us in talking with Ryan. Stick the rap ologist, Today we
00:10:25
are very excited to welcome to No Limits.
00:10:28
The Mitch rap podcast. The world's number one, Mitch
00:10:32
rap fan and now an accomplished author, the real books by
00:10:36
himself. The rap ologist, welcome, Ryan
00:10:40
stick. Thank you man.
00:10:42
As a great intro. Got a lot of accomplishments on
00:10:45
your resume to toot out tonight. Sounded so like genuine and
00:10:48
excited. I'm like, my wife.
00:10:49
Listen to that. So she treats me like I'm more
00:10:51
important after this. It's the it's probably the, the
00:10:56
only time we could say we're having a guest on this pod, that
00:10:59
we know, is more of a rhythmic rap fan than the two of us like
00:11:03
hands down. You are the number one mid ramp
00:11:05
fan. So honored honored to have you
00:11:06
on that matter to come on guys. Thank you for having.
00:11:09
I want to come on for a long time.
00:11:10
I love what you guys are doing and it's nice to be with like
00:11:14
minded. Mitch rap fans.
00:11:16
Yeah. And we actually want to pick up
00:11:17
there. Let's go to the early days.
00:11:19
Yeah, you are the rap ologist. The first time we We were
00:11:23
introduced to your work, was stumbling upon Mitch rap fan.
00:11:26
And I think Chris and I just while we had this idea for the
00:11:29
podcast, we saw your work, we're like wow there's a community out
00:11:33
there of people who just want more rep, any way they can get
00:11:36
it. And you brought two people, a
00:11:37
Blog and book reviews and interviews.
00:11:40
Tell us about the early days of becoming the rap ologist man.
00:11:44
It's so crazy for me to look back on now because it was never
00:11:49
Like something I intended to turn into what it is.
00:11:52
Now I never would have thought like back then it was like the
00:11:56
first steps into a new career for me back.
00:12:00
Then I was a failed sports journalist like coming out of
00:12:03
that like I mean like 2012 ish. Okay.
00:12:07
I Was Detroit. Lions beat reporter for one
00:12:13
year, which was painful. Yeah, yeah.
00:12:15
They've literally, by the way stock from then till now.
00:12:18
So like, I didn't drink much. Believing that career behind,
00:12:20
okay, nothing changed. No nothing has changed.
00:12:22
But I really started to struggle some of my write-ups and felt
00:12:27
like it was a lot harder than it should I knew what I wanted to
00:12:29
say, but getting it out was tough and I remember talking to
00:12:31
my doctor as an adult, and they sent me to do some, you know,
00:12:35
like testing and stuff and my doctor was like, Hey, you know,
00:12:37
you're dyslexic. And I didn't, I didn't know that
00:12:41
made sense when they explained to me, what it was.
00:12:44
And I remember my doctor was like, if you want to beat this,
00:12:46
just go read. Well, I didn't read a lot at the
00:12:49
time. So, one of the first things I
00:12:51
did was, I went home, and I Google dyslexic authors because
00:12:55
I felt like there's an author out there, who's dyslexic.
00:12:57
And they beat this, that's where I want to.
00:12:59
I want to go see their work. I want to see if like they're
00:13:02
actually good at what they do. And literally the first person
00:13:05
that popped up was of insulin. So I actually didn't jump into
00:13:09
the series just yet as wild as this is it was like a few days
00:13:15
maybe like a week or 10 days or so later that Vince died.
00:13:19
And so I member on the news like I saw this and I was like, wow,
00:13:23
that's the guy that that's to author.
00:13:26
I had just been reading about it, like, beat dyslexia, and I
00:13:30
have the news on and they were like, you know, he's known for
00:13:32
his famous, Mitch rap series. And for Consulting on the hit
00:13:35
show, 24, season 5. And I was like, that's It's my
00:13:37
favorite season of that show, like, I love that show.
00:13:40
So I started American Assassin, the night that Mitch wrap our,
00:13:45
the night, Vince Flynn passed away.
00:13:47
Literally that night, I jumped in.
00:13:50
And at the time, my oldest son was going through a lot of
00:13:52
medical issues and we literally had to have like a revolving
00:13:56
24-hour like someone had to have eyes on taking care of him.
00:14:01
And so I always got the night shift and I would read to stay
00:14:05
awake and I read American Assassin like that first night
00:14:11
and was so blown away. I was like this guy is a badass
00:14:15
like I love this. Like I'm so in and I bought I
00:14:19
bought the whole series like the next day and within like I don't
00:14:22
even like a month, maybe I read every single book except for you
00:14:27
know I've never I don't. So this is something I've never
00:14:29
I've never told anyone this, this is like truly an exclusive.
00:14:33
I didn't read term limits. I skip term limits because I
00:14:36
knew Mitch wasn't it. It.
00:14:37
And so I've never admitted this publicly, but I will be honest
00:14:42
with you. The night that I finally read
00:14:44
term limits was the night that Kyle Mills was announced to be
00:14:47
taking over the series and I knew there'd be more books
00:14:50
because I just wanted one more book that like in my life like
00:14:53
if I knew there's still one more, I didn't read you know
00:14:56
it's not a mature at book but I knew the premise and so in my
00:15:00
mind it was like there's always this one that I could turn to
00:15:03
like you know I mean like that still because there's nothing
00:15:06
like that first time through these Books.
00:15:07
Nothing, you know, every time like you're like, Mitch does
00:15:11
something bad ass and then you're like, oh he's so great.
00:15:13
And then you meet this bad guy, you're like, I hate you.
00:15:15
I can't wait till Mitch kills you.
00:15:16
I don't know how that's gonna happen or when, but it's going
00:15:19
to be awesome. And and, you know, it's coming
00:15:21
and there's just nothing like it man.
00:15:23
So I waited and waited and waited.
00:15:25
And I couldn't bring myself to read it because the the journey
00:15:28
was really done. I've never told this probably so
00:15:31
the night Kyle was announced I freaked out and went and
00:15:36
actually we made coffee and sat and read term limits, cover to
00:15:40
cover. And so at the time this is all
00:15:44
going on, we had four kids and I was so Chris knows that's a
00:15:50
struggle. So I had four kids and my wife
00:15:53
was like, yeah, you need to, this is great.
00:15:55
I'm glad you're a fan of this, but like you need to be
00:15:57
productive and like, your sports writer and I didn't feel like
00:16:00
one anymore, I had stepped away. But I was practicing to get back
00:16:05
to it. So, when I was reading the
00:16:07
books, I was taking notes as like, a way to practice watching
00:16:11
an NFL game, jotting down the stats and what's happening, you
00:16:14
know, across the game the course of the game.
00:16:17
You know, that the way because I don't know this, you're writing
00:16:19
your game story while the game is on.
00:16:21
Like while you're watching it, you're right in that game story.
00:16:24
So This truly was like, second nature for me to just be taken
00:16:28
all these crazy notes and writing out all this stuff.
00:16:31
And when I was done, The series I have like I'm not lying like
00:16:36
stacks of legal pads of notes. Just everywhere I look like a
00:16:39
crazy person and I remember, like, I don't know, I'm going to
00:16:42
do with all this, but I've got it, you know, and my wife was
00:16:46
the one who was like, why don't you make like a website and put
00:16:49
all this stuff out there? And I was like, people are going
00:16:52
to think, I'm not, you know, but let's do it.
00:16:54
And so for me, it was I never expect anyone to find it.
00:16:57
I didn't think anyone would come across it.
00:17:00
Truly, I didn't, and the madman. And David Brown, Atria mystery
00:17:05
bus himself is the one who really kind of discovered it and
00:17:08
reached out to me and at the same time, you know, Kyle you
00:17:14
guys have had him on, you know, him like he is so, so different
00:17:18
than Vince when it comes to like, how he goes about writing
00:17:21
a book, he likes all these notes and he wants everything, he can
00:17:25
have and 30 word outlines. And so when he was preparing for
00:17:28
the Survivor, you know, the, the the pretty famous backstory was
00:17:32
he had said Send me everything that Vince had because the
00:17:36
Survivor was announced. And the the first chapter was
00:17:40
on, Vince's website was three pages.
00:17:42
So they said, okay. And they literally sent him the
00:17:46
three pages that were on the website, that was that.
00:17:49
And I know that at the time, he kind of was like, oh my gosh,
00:17:52
you know? And and as The Story Goes, it
00:17:54
was sort of like, David Brown was like, we know a guy and so,
00:17:58
so Kyle and I met and we talked a lot and Early on I was like
00:18:03
stoked because I was hearing it from him, how committed he was
00:18:06
because I was the fear, right? Like yeah, on one hand you're
00:18:08
very excited. Like Mitch rap is going to live
00:18:11
on, on the other hand you're like what if it sucks?
00:18:14
You know, and it's almost like for me it was like on no-lose
00:18:20
situation. It was like when George Lucas
00:18:23
made more Star, Wars movies like this is awesome, it's going to
00:18:25
be awesome, but if it sucks you'll be like this didn't
00:18:27
really count, you know, this shit.
00:18:29
So I went into it really excited.
00:18:31
Like either way, this is going to be Awesome.
00:18:34
And was so blown away by what Kyle was doing.
00:18:38
And at the time, you know, I think the hardest thing for me
00:18:40
was like, that first year, no one knew that Kyle Rote every
00:18:43
page, but the first three pages and so everyone was like, oh
00:18:48
gosh, it's really hard to tell where Vince left off, but, you
00:18:50
know, he did a good job and so glad Kyle could finish this book
00:18:54
and I thought that such an ass backwards way to build it, like
00:18:57
I get why? But Kyle wrote that book, you
00:18:59
know, that was on Kyle. So everyone that loved it and
00:19:02
felt Like Vince's, last work was so great that really is Kyle
00:19:06
Mills and knowing that for me I was like, we're good to go guys.
00:19:10
Like we're good like Kyle's in the driver's seat, he gets it.
00:19:14
He my first conversation with him or like what do you think
00:19:18
special about Mitch wrap and the way he would answer that?
00:19:20
I was like, oh hell yeah. Like this guy gets it like, this
00:19:22
is the mid trap that I love and and, and I was really pumped
00:19:27
and, you know, like, from there, it's so crazy.
00:19:30
I did the Vince Flynn encyclopedia and David Brown,
00:19:33
Made me the rat biologist. That's still probably of all my
00:19:36
name's. That's probably my favorite.
00:19:37
Oh, that was from David. I don't think I knew that David
00:19:40
Brown. Nicknamed me that.
00:19:42
Okay, from there. You know what I really loved was
00:19:46
meeting other people. I love Mitch rap but the thing
00:19:48
that my drove me nuts was there as readers.
00:19:50
I didn't love Mitch the way I did.
00:19:51
You know, they but yeah, he's okay.
00:19:52
I'm like no, you're wrong. He's first always, crave, you're
00:19:55
wrong. He is the best character ever
00:19:56
created. Who you like though?
00:19:58
He's the last man, come on. It's like the Tom Brady of
00:20:01
Thriller protagonist. Let's just be honest.
00:20:03
Okay. And so I never liked understood
00:20:07
how he's not your favorite character.
00:20:09
Okay, I literally did a book signing for my first book fields
00:20:13
of fire and someone was like who's your favorite character?
00:20:16
You know ever created and someone's like it's going to be
00:20:18
Maddie read and I was like, I don't know, it's not like those
00:20:21
names Mitch rap he's really important to me, you know, I
00:20:24
found him at a time of my life again, I had a kid, very serious
00:20:28
medical issues and kind of clung to Mitch, you know.
00:20:33
As a way as an outlet as weird as that sounds.
00:20:36
And, and and didn't get to know Vince.
00:20:40
So I like watched all these interviews and I like felt like
00:20:43
in a weird way. I grieved the loss of Vince
00:20:45
Flynn, like a year after he died, because I was now such a
00:20:48
fan. And it was like this sucks.
00:20:50
Like I'm this huge fat could never meet him now, you know?
00:20:53
And so I have been blessed. Thanks to David Brown and Kyle
00:20:58
Mills in the Flynn family to have like this front row seat to
00:21:01
everything after And I'm so thankful for that.
00:21:04
But what I found was I was very passionate talking about my
00:21:07
trap. There were other people
00:21:10
passionate about other characters in authors and then
00:21:13
there were people that really hadn't discovered a love for
00:21:17
these characters or these books. And I started writing book
00:21:21
reviews for like other outlets and I started realizing like
00:21:25
this could be your career thing because there's no one covering
00:21:28
our genre. And so, when I launched the
00:21:31
books by It was like, I felt like the Thriller genre, was the
00:21:37
NFL league, right? And the authors were like the
00:21:41
teams and the characters were like the players.
00:21:44
Yeah. And my goal was to cover every
00:21:46
level of that. So I wanted to be different
00:21:49
interviews, denounced books announced book deals review, the
00:21:53
books, connect people with books and I launched that in 2014, it
00:22:00
didn't really catch on until 2015.
00:22:02
I don't 2018 that year alone that calendar year.
00:22:06
We did two million unique impressions and that's when I
00:22:08
knew oh this is a thing and I'm probably going to work in
00:22:12
Thrillers for the foreseeable future, nice and none of that,
00:22:16
by the way and then I decided. So I started working as an
00:22:19
editor I decided I was going to write a book and it like so
00:22:22
looking back. This is like a very like half
00:22:25
the show. Answer on your question.
00:22:27
I look back on it now and I'm like, dude, I've never would
00:22:30
have thought back then this would lead to me.
00:22:32
Being a books by being an author, having a son named
00:22:36
Mitch, he enough already all this stuff.
00:22:39
And so I look back on it and it is a wild crazy ride that I feel
00:22:44
very privileged to be on. Well, that's a that's crazy.
00:22:48
Yeah I feel like one of the best parts is come out of doing this
00:22:51
podcast. You mentioned it to is just
00:22:53
connecting with other people you know?
00:22:55
Because often times you can just unless it's like a huge series,
00:22:59
you know Lord of the Rings Harry Potter.
00:23:02
Whatever. You can find that not many
00:23:04
people unless you're like part of a book club that you know,
00:23:08
you have a community and then so once you either you find like
00:23:12
websites like your own or you know, do this podcast and you
00:23:16
engage with fans, you actually see oh there's other people out
00:23:19
there that are like me way more into it than me.
00:23:22
And I like what you said, how there's other people have takes
00:23:25
that, like, you or like how can you have that?
00:23:27
Take like Mitch is the best character, you know, like
00:23:29
materials? It's crazy that it's completely,
00:23:42
right? Like it turns out.
00:23:45
This could have went really bad. Like they could have been like
00:23:48
this guy is nuts. It's like, he's obsessed over
00:23:52
time. Not real person, like no telling
00:23:55
what the other way. I understand that, some people
00:23:58
don't like me trap the most, Everyone's entitled to their own
00:24:01
opinion, they're wrong. They're Up to that opinion,
00:24:03
they're wrong. And you talked about like so
00:24:07
completely changing a life and even the life of my family like
00:24:10
it's just, it's really wild to look back on.
00:24:14
Would you, would you say that like Mitch has almost a part of
00:24:17
your family? Yeah, I mean, so my son
00:24:19
Mitchell, which by the way, I named Mitchell Ryan because I
00:24:22
was determined to put a mention in trying together.
00:24:25
I mean, I felt like, you know, Kyle could have wrote a Ryan
00:24:29
character in there. That was Mitch wrap secret best
00:24:31
friend forever and that have been great.
00:24:32
But He didn't do it. I was determined to put a
00:24:34
missionary and again, so I have a Mitchell Ryan and he calls
00:24:37
himself. The Mitch wrap baby, Nick even
00:24:39
five. Now, he literally refers to
00:24:41
himself, so we play Minecraft. And his name is, Mitch rat baby.
00:24:47
That's awesome. He plays Roblox, it's Mitch wrap
00:24:49
baby, mission accomplished, right?
00:24:52
My kids have have heard me re so I do what I call the daddy
00:24:55
Abridged version and I've read all the matrac books out loud to
00:24:59
them. I like, it's like, it's like
00:25:01
highly edited and then Very Abridged, but but they all know
00:25:05
the gist of them and they're all fans.
00:25:07
And when the movie came out, I like spent hundreds of dollars
00:25:11
to buy this thing called a clear Play device.
00:25:13
So my kids could watch the movie because it takes out like the
00:25:16
swearing and the nudity and stuff like that.
00:25:19
I left the violence in because it's not real.
00:25:21
So I didn't freak out. My wife was like because I was
00:25:23
like, it's not can they watch that part like they know me trap
00:25:26
kills people. And so my wife like consented
00:25:29
and was like fine like just I take out all the other stuff so
00:25:32
So, so they're fans of the movie, man.
00:25:34
Like, they genuinely are fans of Mitch ramp.
00:25:37
That's awesome. Good, get them, young got it.
00:25:39
We got to get the next generation of through the fans.
00:25:42
It Chris. When are we watching American
00:25:44
Assassin with Patrick and Marianne coming over for Mitch,
00:25:47
wrap viewing with the kids. But I have to get one of those
00:25:49
devices that are behind God for sure.
00:25:52
We do need one, you do need one worth it though.
00:25:57
So worth it. That was fun.
00:25:59
So like I don't know if I'm allowed to say this but I will
00:26:02
because What I can do now but so that really cool like DVD
00:26:07
special features were David Brown is interview, right?
00:26:10
Right. I was invited onto the set and
00:26:14
there's been two really important things in my life.
00:26:17
Vince Flynn related that I couldn't partake in because of
00:26:19
my oldest son's health issues. So the first one was the Vince
00:26:23
Flynn Legacy Legacy Event like they invited me out and I was
00:26:27
planning to go. My son, had some really extreme
00:26:29
medical conditions where he like truly Just one time and had to
00:26:34
go by ambulance to the hospital and we found out how bad it was.
00:26:37
And so they kicked us up to U of M and they scheduled him for
00:26:40
test the same. There's like the day before the
00:26:43
day I can remember now because it's so long ago but I couldn't
00:26:46
go to Minnesota for that event. So I was so bummed.
00:26:50
But at the time the whole Flynn family was like, very sweet to
00:26:52
me and they were like, I was like, I'm so sorry I can't be
00:26:55
there. Like, I want to be in there,
00:26:56
like, Vince would have been with his kid.
00:26:59
So, you're doing the right thing, and it made me feel good.
00:27:02
And then After that I never, I never second-guessed it you know
00:27:06
the trip to London to go on the set that one hurt.
00:27:09
So again, I had my son was really going through a tough
00:27:13
medical stretch and just couldn't justify leaving because
00:27:17
we also have, I also have a son is autistic that's a lot to
00:27:21
leave on my wife, you know, at that point we had five kids that
00:27:24
was like a lot to like some. I'm going off to meet Michael
00:27:26
Keaton and Dylan, Brian. Babe, like you have to hold this
00:27:28
down. That was a lot, you know.
00:27:31
And so I couldn't go and so, I broke my heart both times, but
00:27:34
again, the Flynn family, David Brown, everyone was like, hey,
00:27:37
you're doing the right thing but it really sucked for me.
00:27:40
So when I watch that back, I'm like, I could have been mean
00:27:43
like that could have been me behind David and I did all the
00:27:47
prep work. I found out that Michael Keaton
00:27:49
is a germaphobe and I was going to bet David Brown.
00:27:51
Like tell him that I read online, that he likes to be just
00:27:54
spontaneously hugged at random so run up there and I was so
00:27:57
ready for that and I didn't get to do it.
00:27:59
So I was I was so bummed that's good.
00:28:02
So those are two bummer moments but you have some great ones.
00:28:06
Yeah so I think we're going to end up doing like multiple parts
00:28:08
to this at which I hope we do because I would love to do a
00:28:11
show and tell with you guys have you back?
00:28:13
I feel like I have the Vince Flynn Museum over here.
00:28:17
I should have pulled it out for this one.
00:28:18
So what I have is we've been petitioning to get a real museum
00:28:21
by the way installed at his Alma, that's a running gag on
00:28:24
our pot actually. Yeah, yeah.
00:28:27
Well, we could make it happen. So my youngest son, we got
00:28:31
pregnant for the last time. I say the last time because I'm
00:28:34
weirding just so done. But if number five was a boy, I
00:28:38
had lobbied hard for Mitch. And my wife said no.
00:28:41
So, I talked her into naming my daughter, Riley, Anna.
00:28:45
After Anna Riley, you really know that at the time, that kind
00:28:49
of came out later. Did we name our kid after?
00:28:50
I was like, yeah, we did, like, you didn't know.
00:28:53
We made it happen. Rise with.
00:28:56
My youngest with Mitch, I told Melissa.
00:28:59
That's my wife house. Like, if it's a boy, it's got to
00:29:01
be Mitch and she's like I'll think about It so I can remember
00:29:04
which who I was talking to in the Flynn family boat and they
00:29:06
find out they're like, hey Ryan, if it's a boy you know you got a
00:29:08
name a Mitchell and I was like babe the Vintage family said, we
00:29:12
have to like we we can't say no guilt card.
00:29:15
I don't know how that work, but she was like, okay, fine.
00:29:18
If it's a boy it can be Mitch. If it's a girl I get to name the
00:29:21
baby so I was all-in on making this happen, you know.
00:29:24
I mean and so thank God. It was a boy, I got a Mitchell
00:29:28
and I got a gift from one of Vince's Brothers.
00:29:32
In the mail and it was the original MacBook Pro that Vince
00:29:38
wrote his first four books on and that's like the holy grail
00:29:44
for me. So that's cool.
00:29:46
That's really cool. Really awesome.
00:29:50
That's going in the museum. I think the museum gag started,
00:29:53
when David Brown showed us the statue in his office, I'm sure
00:29:57
you've seen it. Oh yeah.
00:29:58
But the Trap coming out of the duct from transfer of power
00:30:00
that? Yeah.
00:30:02
Some fans man over the top over and then, like you said with
00:30:06
your website, the kill catalog, we relied on that for data early
00:30:10
in the Pod, even had a post. How many times he drinks coffee?
00:30:14
We want to find the people who like these eccentric.
00:30:17
Esoteric deep dives into the Because I think what Vince Flynn
00:30:21
created sets itself apart from so much else in the Thriller
00:30:25
verse that it deserves that level of attention.
00:30:27
Yeah, well he checks every box you've created the most badass
00:30:31
character ever created you beat headlines.
00:30:34
I mean, I don't know if you guys know this part you know, like
00:30:36
with Memorial Day when they took a nuke down the Potomac, mmm.
00:30:40
The Pentagon like flag that and was like, you need to hold that
00:30:43
book back because, you know, he's like, surely you had a plan
00:30:47
for that? And I was like, no, no, no, we
00:30:49
don't need it. And so they like wanted like
00:30:51
what? There was stuff in there that
00:30:53
like literally you know what I mean there was that the meeting
00:30:56
President Bush and your little too accurate like all these
00:30:58
things this guy beat headlines and and and when you look at the
00:31:01
Osama Bin Laden raid, Vince had a sequence that's almost
00:31:04
identical to that, right, you know?
00:31:07
And you so you got this great character, you beat the
00:31:10
headlines and then him as a person.
00:31:12
I mean, he's a good-looking guy, he's charismatic, he's so smart,
00:31:16
but he's a guy's guy, you know, like the guy likes Sports and
00:31:20
you did. Someone want to hang out with,
00:31:22
you know what I mean? All the stories, everyone loved
00:31:24
him. He was genuine and hits hits
00:31:28
number one on the New York Times list and doesn't change him.
00:31:30
You know how rare that is? And he had a great family who
00:31:33
kept him grounded, don't get me wrong.
00:31:35
But, you know, Vince was. Vince was the man and you look
00:31:38
at the books and it's like, I totally agree with you.
00:31:41
They're worthy of being poor. Over and looked into and doing a
00:31:44
deep dive because he really put everything into them.
00:31:48
Yeah, there's just a certain quality and not to like, I don't
00:31:53
know. Not to like, put down other
00:31:54
things. We've read that we really
00:31:55
enjoyed but there's just something about reading of
00:31:58
insulin novel. I don't know.
00:31:59
It just it when we doing the Deep dive dirt, you know,
00:32:03
starting this during covid and, you know, hashing out these
00:32:06
books because both me and Mike had obviously read them multiple
00:32:09
times before and then going back and actually like Discussing
00:32:13
these things for the first time, it brought a whole new
00:32:15
appreciation to how well crafted this Series has been.
00:32:20
And I think like, I don't know, we were going to ask you like
00:32:22
how you think, you kind of mentioned it to how Kyle has now
00:32:25
taken it and you know, obviously continue that work but then
00:32:29
adapted on, you know, brought his spin to it.
00:32:32
What have you thought of the last couple of novels, were you
00:32:36
a fan of the, the mic and spoiler?
00:32:38
But Mike Nasha Enemy at the gates turned that kind of roiled
00:32:41
the fandom. Little bit.
00:32:43
Yeah, I mean so much that I have a take on this in the same way
00:32:47
that if you tell me, Mitch rap is not the greatest character
00:32:49
ever created. You're wrong.
00:32:50
So, when you tell me that like, Mike, Nash would never do that.
00:32:54
You're wrong, I'm sorry, I hear you again, he loves the wrong.
00:32:57
This is true, you're wrong it the it was there from the
00:32:59
beginning. He always was not so much.
00:33:02
A, if he's a brother to Mitch, he's the little brother that
00:33:06
doesn't listen, that always is going against the Big Brother.
00:33:08
Yes, everyone. That's like, you know, he was a
00:33:11
tough guy to know he's He's really not Vince.
00:33:14
I mean Vince wrote a sequence you guys know like Mitchell one
00:33:19
Palm to the chest and like Nash is on his ass like he's not
00:33:22
going to come after Mitch wrap. Okay, so can we just stop that
00:33:25
whole like but the idea that like he's the Golden Boy and
00:33:29
would not. There's the groundwork.
00:33:30
Is there in the books? If you look closely yeah, this
00:33:34
is in character with Mike Nash. This is not the only shock was
00:33:38
that Kyle really did it, right? I know that was a huge egg.
00:33:42
Phones to do it like that, but it's not in any way.
00:33:46
Shocking me that at Nash would do it.
00:33:48
I give Kyle credit for, for actually seeing a through, but I
00:33:54
thought it was genuine to the character Vince created and made
00:33:59
a lot of sense in the story. Yep.
00:34:02
I think Kyle anyone because every once in a while, it's not
00:34:05
common on the Facebook threads or somewhere else in the group's
00:34:10
someone will inadvertently say. You know, I stopped reading
00:34:13
after, you know, Vince past and and it's never been the same
00:34:16
since or Kyle Mills books, just haven't kept up the tradition.
00:34:19
Once again, you're entitled to your opinion, but again, it's a
00:34:21
wrong and wrong. They're wrong.
00:34:23
Kyle pulls on those threads. Yeah.
00:34:26
For, as little as Vince left him with notes, like you're saying,
00:34:29
you know, the three pages to start, the Survivor, Kyle was
00:34:33
able to find the threads, pull on them, unravel them and, and
00:34:37
weave them into his own version of Storytelling, that's very
00:34:40
much within the themes. And you know, the Zeitgeist of
00:34:44
what is in a meat wrap novel and it's just genius.
00:34:47
He picked up on the stuff with such little little cues and
00:34:50
everything he's doing is, is honoring.
00:34:53
Vince gets honoring the characters and the characters,
00:34:56
he's made on his own and the stories.
00:34:58
He's taken to update the work. You know, he's always talking
00:35:01
about how Vincent never saw the rise of Isis in his lifetime.
00:35:04
Yes. Yeah, he's writing it.
00:35:05
Exactly how I think Vince would have done so himself.
00:35:09
I totally agree with you and I can say I've I've seen firsthand
00:35:14
what Kyle does to prep. I've had dinner with them.
00:35:18
I've talked to him a lot and I am in know what?
00:35:22
I take zero credit for anything. You know, he's he said to me,
00:35:26
like, here's my notes. What do you think that kind of a
00:35:29
thing? We've talked a lot about, but a
00:35:31
lot of this stuff man, but like I see the depth of it behind the
00:35:35
scenes, how much he really puts into this and how much he cares,
00:35:39
how important it is to Kyle, to stay true to what Vince is
00:35:42
doing. And at the same time, the world
00:35:44
is changing and evolving, and it's silly to think that events
00:35:48
were alive today. He'd still be writing.
00:35:50
Middle Eastern, terrorism versus Mitch rap.
00:35:52
Like that's not where the world is.
00:35:54
Vince was going to take on Whatever threats were there.
00:35:59
Now, look, one of the things made Vince Flynn, Vince Flynn
00:36:01
was he was capturing Middle Eastern terrorism for what it
00:36:04
was while everyone else was still focused on Russia Clancy.
00:36:08
And some of the old guys like that, like Vince was really one
00:36:10
of those young authors of the time that was hitting on the
00:36:14
next threat. So it's stupid to think that
00:36:16
Vince wouldn't have been looking for the next threat for Mitch
00:36:19
wrap. Whether that was inside the us
00:36:22
or whether that was outside, its logical that he would have been
00:36:25
doing that too. To Kyle's doing the same thing.
00:36:27
He's doing it at a very high level.
00:36:29
Yeah. Also, would you say he's Mitch
00:36:33
was always different than the other Thriller characters or
00:36:37
superheroes in these books because he was a human.
00:36:40
Yeah, he was a family, man. He almost had those qualities
00:36:43
that Vince had and just look at that scene where he finds out
00:36:48
that Ana's pregnant. I think he's brought to tears in
00:36:51
this restaurant. A lot of these tough guys, I
00:36:53
don't think authors would be willing to write The Human Side
00:36:56
of Them as strongly as Vince would do.
00:36:59
And maybe it's part of his Catholic background of knowing
00:37:01
that, you know, what true manhood is and whatnot.
00:37:03
He's willing to go into those vulnerable areas and so Mitch is
00:37:07
pretty vulnerable. And now we see Kyle putting
00:37:10
Mitch as a father figure with baby Anna.
00:37:13
And I think it's just brilliant seeing that.
00:37:15
And some people have said, oh, it's Mitch's being domesticated,
00:37:19
he's not killing enough. I think that's the furthest
00:37:21
thing from the truth because it's a new stage of his life.
00:37:24
Vince would have written him becoming a Man becoming a father
00:37:28
and I love how an oath of loyalty.
00:37:29
We got to hear your take on oath of loyalty and even says to a
00:37:32
mitch, you've been such a great father to Anna that brought me
00:37:35
to tears because it's just, he's it's a whole new Mitch even
00:37:39
though it's the same Mitch, it's what he always wanted.
00:37:42
Yes, anyone that's like this, you know, I hate this take on
00:37:46
Mitch rap Mitch right. This is what my trap, always
00:37:48
wanted things. Got dark later in the series and
00:37:53
I look back at that as, you know, Vince was dealing with
00:37:55
cancer. And I look Take a second.
00:37:57
By the way, to acknowledge the fact that this guy is diagnosed
00:38:01
with cancer and still wrote two books to a very good, very good.
00:38:06
I'm telling you right now, like as an author which is still
00:38:09
weird for me to say because I have one book out and I finished
00:38:12
my second one and turned it in. I promise you if they diagnosed
00:38:16
with cancer, I am not writing a book like I am focused on that.
00:38:20
You know what I mean, this guy gave us Mitch wrap and put my
00:38:23
trap in his fans first and so on.
00:38:26
I like to look at it under that lens, who is Mitch rap and he
00:38:29
had gotten pretty dark for a while their post consent to
00:38:32
kill. I think very wisely.
00:38:35
Kyle knew he had to give him his soul back, but that can't just
00:38:37
happen. There's got to be planned for
00:38:40
that. Well, all Kyle did is look at.
00:38:43
What does Mitch want? What did Vince want to give him?
00:38:47
And FYI there's plenty of interviews where Vince says, you
00:38:51
know, one day, I want to explore Mitch rap as a father, so people
00:38:54
that think this never would have happened.
00:38:56
Again, you're entitled to your wrong opinion, but it's
00:38:58
incorrect. It's not right?
00:39:01
That Vince did plan on that. Kyle.
00:39:03
Just followed the blueprint. That was there.
00:39:06
Now, as for Mitch himself, I couldn't be happier for the guy.
00:39:09
I had described Mitch rap as like a best friend of mine that
00:39:13
I could never meet in person, right?
00:39:15
But every time that book comes out, it's like my best friend's
00:39:18
back in town for a weekend. Yes.
00:39:20
And I get to spend it with them and, man, I am hyped, okay?
00:39:24
Yeah, I am hyped. And so it's great for me to see
00:39:29
Mitch with his soul, back allowed to be happy, but still
00:39:35
doing his job. You know, the biggest complaint
00:39:37
that I see about Metropolis is so stupid.
00:39:40
Is there like always to Superman?
00:39:41
Like I don't agree. The guy's got a big scar on his
00:39:44
face. Okay, that's a reminder right
00:39:46
there, he bleeds. Okay.
00:39:48
Secondly, they say that because Mitch raps never been bested,
00:39:52
that's only mostly true. Just so, you know, yes, my trap
00:39:55
is like, Every fight. He's been in, but it's always
00:39:59
you ever notice it's written in a way that's actually
00:40:00
believable. Yeah, no it is.
00:40:02
There's other Kai won't name them but I cover them and
00:40:05
they're supposed to be the alpha males.
00:40:07
Yep. They get bested.
00:40:08
Yeah, and I'm always like I'll read these and this is no
00:40:11
offense. Any other author, some big fans
00:40:12
of these guys but I'll read it all a true.
00:40:15
But trap would have smoked that dude.
00:40:16
Just so you know, like I feel that way when I read him, I'm
00:40:19
like this guy got his ass kicked and Mitch would have definitely
00:40:22
smoke this guy. But anyways, it's done in a way
00:40:25
that's not common. Color over the top, it's
00:40:27
actually believable. Like, we believe Mitch is really
00:40:30
this, good at what he does, which is why it's believable.
00:40:33
He's doing it into his 40s by the way.
00:40:36
Yeah, you know, because the table was set for that.
00:40:38
So I think Kyle is really delivered.
00:40:41
So so well on to that, I enjoy seeing Mitch at this next phase
00:40:46
and it makes sense, man. The the world's changing the
00:40:49
country's changing Mitch wrap is going to change a little bit,
00:40:53
which is why I thought me, ask my taking an oath of loyalty.
00:40:57
I thought it was so brilliant because the world is changing
00:41:00
the country is changing the country.
00:41:02
That Mitch rap has spent his whole life protecting as now
00:41:07
turned on him. And that is brilliant, right?
00:41:11
And it's not just Mitch, it's Irene caught in that Crossfire
00:41:13
to. Yeah.
00:41:15
Well unfortunately some of that stuff is closer than the reality
00:41:20
than we'd like yeah in today's world, right?
00:41:23
And I mean not to be political and I don't go there ever
00:41:26
Publicly with, you know, any any my platforms but like if just
00:41:30
read the news okay like it's it's realistic and I think to
00:41:33
capture that and show it through Mitch's eyes and point of view
00:41:38
is a unique take on this you know and I think Kyle did it all
00:41:45
very well but that that have the stones to do what he did with
00:41:49
Mike Nash to have Mitch betrayed by the country.
00:41:52
He has spent his whole adult life protecting This guy is a
00:41:57
blade to keep the flag red numerous times.
00:42:01
Now be on the other side of that and Irene's on the other side of
00:42:05
that and everything that they've known, it's all kind of in
00:42:08
shambles and they don't really know what's going to happen.
00:42:10
Next to me that is as bold and daring as killing off, Anna
00:42:17
Riley, right? And consent to kill and that's
00:42:20
why I think oath of loyalty is. I really mean this.
00:42:23
I think it's the best Mitch Rap Book since consent to kill.
00:42:26
Mike said the same thing. That's funny.
00:42:28
I did I say Kyle's best. As I said by far, yeah, I said I
00:42:33
think it's Kyle's consent to kill.
00:42:36
I will say that. I also think it's his absolute
00:42:39
best dialogue and character writing he's ever written even
00:42:42
reading most of his other books. I just think he was at the top
00:42:45
of his game, though. The words that he put in the
00:42:48
characters, mouths the stories and situations, he built and
00:42:51
where he moved America to the book, was both personal and
00:42:55
Grand. It had this like microcosm and
00:42:57
macrocosm of everything. In the mid trap universe that we
00:43:00
love And the cooks. I think we're a big part of
00:43:02
that. I.
00:43:03
Yeah, I think they might be on the level of some of Vince's
00:43:07
early villains. Like, I think the cooks are up
00:43:09
there with what's-his-name. I'm Clark.
00:43:13
I'll tell you, I'll tell you. Why don't we talk about Mitch
00:43:15
wrapping Stone Cold. Here's how it's Stone Cold.
00:43:17
Men's Flynn was you have stood Garrett, introducing your very
00:43:20
first book, ever in term limits, its dude, waited a decade to
00:43:25
smoke him and we're gonna freak about that.
00:43:28
What a rat that guy was weird. We and act of treason with Irene
00:43:33
smoking or first guy right in the oval.
00:43:35
And it's like, oh my gosh, like and then, you know, Mitch
00:43:38
Raskin, his skills to Garrett, but he's told, you have to wait
00:43:40
a year. This is so brilliant because the
00:43:42
publishing schedule is one book a year it.
00:43:44
And so, here comes protecting the fan.
00:43:46
And I was like, oh, I hope Miss kills this guy, you know.
00:43:48
So literally a year later in real time Mitch rap is swimming
00:43:52
out to that. Yeah you know Vince waited a
00:43:55
decade to kill this guy and what he was so brilliant at yes he
00:43:59
created the hero we all love Of what he also did.
00:44:01
As he created all the villains we hate.
00:44:03
Yeah, I hate all these people like every teacher.
00:44:05
Who's your favorite villain? Oh, it's, you know, it's tough
00:44:09
for me. I think Stu Garrett would be
00:44:10
like way up there because he's everything we hate about
00:44:12
politics and all of that in general for me.
00:44:17
And I'll be I'd so this is okay. I'm going to tell you who I'm
00:44:19
going to talk about something. I've never really talked about
00:44:20
publicly but it's Louis Gould. I hate him.
00:44:24
Absolutely hate them. It took me like a whole book to
00:44:28
accept that. Mitch would be with his wife at
00:44:31
first. I was like, what are we doing?
00:44:35
What are you like? I just had such a hard time.
00:44:38
Like Kyle could tell you, if you remember the behind-the-scenes
00:44:40
stuff we went to dinner one time when I pitched him and he was
00:44:43
kind of talking to me about it. I was like, no, like why don't
00:44:47
you bring back? Greta.
00:44:48
See, I liked her like, yeah. Where the hell is Greta?
00:44:51
What happened to Greta? Greta, she was smoking hot.
00:44:54
She loved me. That she was like bandaged up
00:44:56
his wounds like she's an old liar to show you how my brain
00:44:59
works very differently than like Kyle's or talking about this
00:45:02
over dinner. And I'm like, you know, I bring
00:45:04
credit back like, you know, we're talking about and he's
00:45:06
like, no, because something would have had to happen.
00:45:08
That was so bad, she's never ever mentioned again.
00:45:11
No, Vince went back and wrote those books after he wrote the
00:45:15
whole middle of the series, like he couldn't have mentioned her,
00:45:17
she wasn't created yet right. I think she's in hiding and it's
00:45:21
the perfect happens, the bring her back, you know, it's Took me
00:45:25
literally like a whole book to like kind of accept that Mitch
00:45:29
rap was with Louis Gold's Widow. I at the time I was like, I
00:45:35
don't love it and now it makes all the sense in the world.
00:45:38
Now I get it, which I'll never doubt Kyle.
00:45:42
And, and Kyle, we trust for that reason, alone.
00:45:44
He made it really work, you know, he made it work.
00:45:47
It could have, it could have went off the rails though, so,
00:45:50
it could have went bad. Like that's, I mean, it would
00:45:51
have, you could have went big bad, but instead, there's
00:45:54
something kind of beautiful Eautiful about.
00:45:56
We'll look, I have three adopted children so I love.
00:46:00
I'm a big believer in blood doesn't make you family, that
00:46:04
makes you relatives and that concept.
00:46:08
So, I kind of really like, for me, it's like nice seeing Mitch
00:46:11
raise a kid. It's not biologically.
00:46:12
His I know what that's like, but there's also something kind of
00:46:15
beautiful about raising the kid that was named after your late
00:46:17
wife. Yes, and he really makes it
00:46:19
work. That's, that's where I was sold.
00:46:23
And I do understand people who initially, He hesitated and and
00:46:26
still do some people still don't even like that, that quality is
00:46:29
around. But and I've said this on our
00:46:31
pod and Chris, you've heard me a million times, the consent to
00:46:35
kill epilogue to me is my favorite single piece of text,
00:46:40
favorite chapter, Vince, ever wrote.
00:46:43
It is so important to whom itches and it's the small
00:46:47
things. The way he almost questions
00:46:50
himself on pointing a gun at this mother and child.
00:46:53
It's almost like a Mariah Madonna.
00:46:55
Kind of seen it. And I just the way he asks
00:46:58
himself, who am I while he had? He's waving a gun at a mother.
00:47:01
And child to me, is like, Vince knew there was something there,
00:47:06
that's going to change Mitch, and that door was open.
00:47:09
And then the other thing Kyle did when he, when Mitch first
00:47:12
goes to check on Claudia, I think it was, I think might have
00:47:16
been South Africa, even, and he sees baby Anna there and there's
00:47:20
this scene where he sees them again after the epilogue and
00:47:24
consent to kill was the last He saw them the way Kyle wrote that
00:47:28
it worked for me, it really worked right from the jump and I
00:47:31
know for others, it didn't, but I put those two scenes together
00:47:34
in my mind that it changed Mitch.
00:47:36
And once a scene like that changes Mitch, it's unfinished
00:47:39
business, it's going to have to, it's going to have to come back.
00:47:42
I agree. I agree.
00:47:45
And he made it work and I mean referencing order to kill.
00:47:50
To me, that was Kyle's best book before this one oath of loyalty.
00:47:54
I loved ordered kill because The first time we see Mitch rap,
00:47:57
dude, I'm not like everyone's like well Louis Gould was a
00:48:00
great like I hate him so bad, I don't even consider him and
00:48:02
Mitch wraps League. Like, no, thanks.
00:48:05
He got killed by eight-year-old Stan Hurley.
00:48:07
So I don't think so. I was thinking, I'd seen.
00:48:11
Yeah, it's a great scene, but I'm not all the hype it up,
00:48:14
Lewis Gould. I love Grisha.
00:48:17
And I think to seen Mitch wrap finally, have an adversary who
00:48:21
could hold their own against him, right?
00:48:24
What's Great. And you can't sell that if he
00:48:28
doesn't hurt, Scott Coleman. That was the book.
00:48:31
I was sweating it, by the way. I'm like that's going to be
00:48:34
Coleman dies. I'm about to really cry here.
00:48:36
Like, this is gonna be a grown man, ugly cry session.
00:48:38
You can't take Scott Coleman, like just Mitch's loss.
00:48:41
Is his wife is baby is, as many of his mentor's, both really in
00:48:47
Stansfield and Hurley, like he's got a little bit down to only
00:48:50
like, his brother that we never see hardly ever Irene Kennedy.
00:48:55
And Tommy's again. Have no one after this.
00:48:57
Like I was feeling it sounds like he needs to make a full
00:48:59
recovery, but you can't sell that if you don't do that.
00:49:03
And you kill two birds with one stone you show, that Greece is a
00:49:06
badass and Mitch doesn't have his right-hand man.
00:49:08
So, it truly is One V one now and that was that was my
00:49:13
favorite. That was my favorite Kyle Mills
00:49:16
book before oath of loyalty. I think that's still Kyle's best
00:49:20
scene and definitely best action scene is the Grisha verse Scott
00:49:23
fight. Yeah.
00:49:24
I agree. It's not even the the Grecian
00:49:26
Versa Mitch rep, right? That one was almost, you know,
00:49:30
that I remember actually, we Chris both you and I agreed on
00:49:32
the podcast, the first half of that book, some of our favorite
00:49:35
in the whole series, the second half just didn't raise to that
00:49:38
level. So we liked that book but the
00:49:41
first half was definitely. Yeah, there was a part of me
00:49:43
that wanted to see Mitch curb stomp Grisha, you know, and I
00:49:49
was happy to see. See him come back because I was
00:49:52
kind of like, wondering what he was doing.
00:49:54
Like towel and especially in this last book, Kyle was like
00:49:57
pulling on all these like, callbacks and yeah, I don't know
00:50:01
where we got. We got a call from Grisha.
00:50:04
And what, as well as like, we could reference to transfer of
00:50:06
power. Right?
00:50:07
Where? Yeah he gets putting he's like
00:50:10
oh I saved president not not too far from this bunker where I'm
00:50:13
being about to be Shackled. Yep.
00:50:16
Speaking of non rap characters. Who would you say is your
00:50:20
favorite on-ramp, character? It's tough, but Irene for sure,
00:50:26
for me. Yeah, and a lot of weight, she's
00:50:29
the OG character. I mean, she is so important and
00:50:33
transfer power. Power.
00:50:34
I mean, she recruited the hero, you know, but I love her loyalty
00:50:37
to match. That's really what it is and
00:50:39
Coleman has it to don't get me wrong but I love the way that
00:50:43
Kennedy is very much like a big sister who has his back and
00:50:48
trust him. So completely, if you actually
00:50:52
go back and look by the way Coleman questions, Mitch more
00:50:56
than Irene does Scott, a lot of times I'll be like, are you sure
00:51:00
more than more than Irene? Who usually knows if Mitch is,
00:51:03
In. This is a, it's gospel.
00:51:06
Like that's what it is. And I just love that.
00:51:09
I love that about her and their trust together.
00:51:13
And I love the way they interact.
00:51:14
Especially after, you know, big moments, one of my favorite
00:51:18
scenes with them is when Mitch finds out that that Anna died,
00:51:24
you know, his scene with, with her.
00:51:26
I love where they're at the safe house and trying to have this
00:51:30
nice moment and this whole hit team rolls up like they're going
00:51:33
to do. Nothing and Mitch kills, every
00:51:35
single one of them because he still Mitch and we see how
00:51:37
pissed he is, but I just really love the Dynamics of the
00:51:40
relationship. Also, how smart she is, you
00:51:43
know, she was she learned from the best and Thomas Stansfield,
00:51:47
a spy's spy and we see her in body that she's also not afraid
00:51:53
to get her hands dirty. We've seen her do that.
00:51:56
Yes, you know I I love that scene.
00:52:01
An act of treason. Was she really killed someone
00:52:03
right in the Oval Office. I think that's one of the best
00:52:05
scenes in the series as you're like commenting on his reaction
00:52:09
to it, by the way. Yeah, pretty wild.
00:52:11
Oh, who did just like, are you okay?
00:52:13
Yeah, and she's like, I'm fine. Yep.
00:52:15
And she's like, all professional.
00:52:18
Moving on. Yeah, it was great.
00:52:20
So, so her eye Michael O'Rourke. Was, when I really liked, I
00:52:25
actually wish he would come back.
00:52:26
I wish we could find a role for him.
00:52:29
I wish we could vote for him in Congress, right?
00:52:31
I'm with you, you know, there's a couple.
00:52:35
I mean I like both former presidents.
00:52:39
I actually wish we knew more, what's going on with them?
00:52:42
Post, that's a good point. Yeah, being an office.
00:52:45
There's actually another author that I cover that I like named
00:52:48
Steve Berry and please cotton Malone series.
00:52:52
There's like this fan, favorite President Danny Daniels and yeah
00:52:56
he gets out of office. He runs for Congress, it way to
00:53:00
stay involved. Like he can't be president
00:53:01
again, so he's like, I'm not just gonna leave like screw
00:53:04
these bastards. I'm not done yet and I so I know
00:53:07
there's a part of me that almost wishes we knew more about what
00:53:10
was going on with the former presidents.
00:53:13
Specially Alexander because I typically, I was really fond of
00:53:16
him. The whole what he had me at the
00:53:18
whole I played football sometimes, it's better to be on
00:53:20
offense, like come on, take the leash off, Mitch wrap and let
00:53:24
him eat like that's what we want to see.
00:53:25
Anyways, like I was in love this guy.
00:53:27
Good. But at the same time, you know,
00:53:31
he had a different president, give him a consent to kill
00:53:33
everyone involved. So I'm a big fan of both of them
00:53:36
Dark Horse. We've already talked about, I
00:53:38
really liked Greta. I wish we knew what happened.
00:53:42
I wish we knew where she was, we need that third book like the
00:53:47
third. Yeah we really do.
00:53:48
Oh skill-shot book. You know?
00:53:50
Yeah we need what Falls between kill shot, and term and term
00:53:54
limits for sure. I wish they would let Kyle write
00:53:57
that book. But Hurley is a favorite.
00:54:01
Oh yeah, you know. How can you not be?
00:54:04
I love that. He got to go out in a lot of
00:54:07
ways protecting the Trap because that to me that seem like it's
00:54:11
crazy thinking like biting a dude's thrown out but to me it's
00:54:13
actually kind of like beautiful in the sense that I'm done.
00:54:18
Like I'm checking out now. Don't worry your biggest threat.
00:54:22
I'm taking with me. He does he removes the biggest
00:54:25
person who's a threat to Mitch and Lois gold that slimeball and
00:54:30
literally eats his throat out? And I love it?
00:54:32
Yeah, I love it. I love that.
00:54:33
We gave him one more high priority Target to take out.
00:54:37
You know, I love that scene. And the last man is almost
00:54:41
that's the whole Arc, right? It's yeah, it's Vince's last
00:54:44
book. He probably senses in the back
00:54:47
of Mind that it's this is this is going to be it and he almost
00:54:50
writes this swan song. Yep.
00:54:52
And it mirrors Hurley Hurley mirrors him.
00:54:55
There's I think one of the more haunting scenes that sticks with
00:54:58
me is, I think it's they're out on a patio and I think it's Nash
00:55:02
and Irene inside the kitchen. Looking through the glass door.
00:55:05
Yep. Out at Stan and Mitch.
00:55:09
In the chairs. And it's just like, It's great
00:55:13
seeing you meaningful. It's so deep.
00:55:15
And just know it's Vince's last book and that Kyle was, was
00:55:19
willing to put that in the Survivor and pick up on that and
00:55:22
just it made the transition almost Magical Mystery.
00:55:25
Listen, it has this haunting Aura.
00:55:27
I totally agree as an author myself now.
00:55:30
Do you know the kind of anxiety? It would give me if someone was
00:55:33
like, hey, we need you to take over this number one, New York
00:55:36
Times best selling Series right now, and you're like, okay, I
00:55:39
can write whatever I want. No needs to be a direct sequel
00:55:41
to the last book. The author wrote.
00:55:43
Okay. Is the, is the antagonist.
00:55:45
Alive, know, they're dead. Like, you're like I've got a lot
00:55:48
to work. Hard course, and that's that
00:55:50
demanding fan base. Oh my gosh.
00:55:53
Like that would be, I would lose my mind.
00:55:57
Then I would be so scared. And instead Kyle found a way to
00:56:01
make all that work, and I felt like wrapped up the Vince Flynn
00:56:09
Part of these books. You know this series brought it
00:56:13
to a really satisfying conclusion in a way that was so
00:56:17
well done that it kind of close that door and open a new one for
00:56:21
us to come back with order to kill and Beyond and I think
00:56:24
that's why it works so well. Yeah.
00:56:29
O'Leary, so you mentioned I guess we want to you know, we
00:56:32
don't have too much time. You said you gotta go but you
00:56:35
mentioned a couple times and you're now an author fields of
00:56:38
fire. Well, both Mike, and I had a
00:56:41
chance to read it. I think is very good excited for
00:56:43
the next one. Oh, thank you, man.
00:56:44
You had a pub day. August August 2nd.
00:56:47
So, it's been a couple months have.
00:56:48
What has it been like to be a published author now?
00:56:51
Um, terrifying because I signed that contract was a two-book
00:56:54
deal and it dawned on me like, after about a month.
00:56:56
Like they're going to want me to write this second book.
00:56:59
I'm probably going to need to go do that.
00:57:01
The paper shortage actually pushed back my Pub date till
00:57:05
September 6 and it was like in a weird way of Full Circle moment
00:57:09
for me because I came out one week, before Mitch rap it's been
00:57:13
really sir. I don't like, I'm still at the
00:57:15
point, like, we're like my kids friends like a, what do you do
00:57:18
for a living? Mr. Stack.
00:57:19
And I'm like her. So I hate being called that but
00:57:22
like oh I'm an editor. I'm a books by and my oldest
00:57:26
kids are like Had call yourself an author and way.
00:57:28
Oh yeah. I like I like tell your parents
00:57:30
to buy my books. You know, it's been amazing.
00:57:35
It's something I've always wanted to do didn't have the
00:57:37
confidence to do or the time to do for a long time and finally
00:57:39
committed to it. A lot of people ask me, if my
00:57:41
character Matthew read, its initials are based off of Mitch
00:57:45
rat. No, they're not.
00:57:46
I created him in high school for a creative writing assignment
00:57:50
that got me suspended from school for a whole week because
00:57:53
it was so violent. And I I actually said to my age
00:57:57
and I was like, should I change the name?
00:57:59
Because it's, and he was like, why?
00:58:00
And I'm like because Matthew red Mitch wrap and he's like, I
00:58:03
never even would have thought of that.
00:58:04
Like, if you would have said, I don't think people are going to
00:58:06
think of it. And the problem is the character
00:58:10
was so real to me, he'd been with me for like, 20 years.
00:58:14
I I couldn't rename him. It was like really tough.
00:58:17
So a lot of people think that that's actually not true.
00:58:19
There's a few moments for sure. Where you can see, I would hope.
00:58:27
I hope you could see the where my love of Vince Flynn plays a
00:58:30
role in me as an author. He's mentioned prominently in
00:58:34
the acknowledgements of fields of fire and that book, it's not
00:58:39
a Vince Flynn like book but I said to my agent, when I was
00:58:41
going to write it I said, I my two favorite authors in the
00:58:44
world are Vince Flynn and CJ box and they couldn't be more
00:58:46
different than, you know, anything about that comes
00:58:48
through. Yeah, if you see anything more
00:58:49
about CJ box, I mean he's not Vince.
00:58:51
When Joe picked Not his character.
00:58:53
Joe pig is not much rap he's the opposite, right?
00:58:56
And I said to my age and I'm going to write then swim meet CJ
00:58:59
box and I remember there was like this long sign.
00:59:01
He went what the hell does that look like?
00:59:05
And I was like, give me a year. Let's find out.
00:59:06
I don't know yet. I'm gonna go.
00:59:07
I'm gonna go find out. And there were people surprised,
00:59:10
I think, when they read my book and they're like, I thought was
00:59:12
gonna be just like Vince Flynn. I'm not smart enough to write
00:59:14
those books, man. I'm really not, I don't have
00:59:17
instead that there was going to be one Vince Flynn, where, you
00:59:19
know, how lucky we are. We got to Kyle Mills.
00:59:22
Right. Yeah, I would hate to be the
00:59:24
person that has to step in after that.
00:59:26
Okay? Because you're just not going to
00:59:28
keep catching lightning in a bottle that many times.
00:59:30
We are so blessed as a fan base to have Kyle following Vince.
00:59:34
It's unreal. And so let me just tell you,
00:59:36
like, there's a, it's a lot harder than people think to
00:59:39
write a book, okay? And even to get published, and
00:59:43
so the fact that we get just a plus storytellers from Vince and
00:59:48
to Kyle, I don't think you're getting that a third time.
00:59:50
So I have a whole new appreciation, but I wanted to
00:59:54
stay true, you know, I like to say Vince Flynn made me fall in
00:59:57
love with Thrillers CJ box made me want to be an author because
01:00:01
those are stories. I felt like I could tell and I
01:00:03
don't mean that in the like he's less smart than Vince Flynn kind
01:00:07
of way. It's like these localized to a
01:00:10
certain area out west stories, really appealed to me.
01:00:14
I can't pull off the kind of stuff that Vince does.
01:00:18
I don't think I could honestly. I'm so glad Kyle can.
01:00:22
So for me, it was like one of the stories I could tell you
01:00:24
don't, we don't see a mitch wrap character out west.
01:00:27
We don't see that never get that.
01:00:30
And to me, that was so obvious because it's like, man out west,
01:00:34
you really are alone, like, backup is not minutes away.
01:00:38
It is hours at Best Days at worst, like the stakes are
01:00:43
heightened and I thought, okay, I want to set a mitch rap ish
01:00:48
like character out west and that's, that's It's really how
01:00:51
my series is born. So my series is about a former
01:00:53
Marine Raider who gets out of the military and goes back home.
01:00:57
For the first time in over a decade to his little town in
01:00:59
Montana to find his adopted father, murdered and as he
01:01:03
investigates and looks into that he uncovers a global conspiracy
01:01:07
that only he can stop. So there's those, those big, you
01:01:11
know, Mitch rap type action scenes, but set in a Siege a box
01:01:15
like universe, and I'm really excited about.
01:01:18
So, thank you both. By the way, for reading it,
01:01:20
guys, I really She ate that horse to I'm so much higher on,
01:01:24
it's called lethal range. It comes out August 15th 2023
01:01:28
available for pre-order, wherever books are sold and all
01:01:30
formats. And I'm told I have to say that
01:01:35
just so you know but hey make it plug plug away.
01:01:39
The second one I went for like the first one, you have to
01:01:43
establish things. There is some action in there,
01:01:46
but the second one really opens with action and does not stop
01:01:49
till the end like Every time you think, oh, this is probably the
01:01:52
big action sequence. It's not the next one's bigger
01:01:55
than the next one's bigger, and the next one's bigger.
01:01:57
And I remember, I turned into my publisher.
01:01:59
They actually like called and said, hey, dude, are you aware
01:02:02
that? It's like pretty much all action
01:02:04
and I was like, yes, yes, I knew that by Design so that worked
01:02:09
out. Okay.
01:02:11
And their organs want to make? Sure did you want to add in a
01:02:13
few, like slower moments? And I was like, no, I'm really I
01:02:16
like, where this one's yet. So the few people have read it.
01:02:20
Agent and a couple people very close to me.
01:02:24
Felt like it was much better than fields of fire, so I can't
01:02:26
wait for August 15th. It's special for me because, you
01:02:31
know, we talk about like Coleman being this best friend to Mitch
01:02:33
wrap and Irene Kennedy has his back.
01:02:35
So my real life best friend, is name is Mikey Derham when he
01:02:38
bought the house across from mine and we have dogs, big
01:02:41
Rottweilers who are brothers and eat dinner every night, we're
01:02:43
like family, and I was actually writing book to and realize that
01:02:47
red needed a sidekick and it's someone he could.
01:02:50
Could trust. So I just wrote my best friend
01:02:52
into the book and didn't tell my publisher, he's based on a real
01:02:54
person. So when I turned it in there
01:02:56
like we love this likes new character, like you did your
01:02:59
homework, like he really feels real and fleshed out and I was
01:03:02
like, thank you. Like I knew I should have told
01:03:04
them he was based off of my best friend, but I was like.
01:03:07
Now let him think I'm really good at this for a minute and
01:03:09
then and then later I fessed up. So it's fun for me for all those
01:03:16
reasons. I think you see more Mitch wrap
01:03:18
like stuff in this book. Certainly.
01:03:21
What? I love about Vince's action is
01:03:24
in Lethal range and and I'm really pumped up about that.
01:03:29
So I'm excited, man. And yeah, I think where you left
01:03:34
us Matty red is, he's ready to rip.
01:03:36
He is ready to rip up to and I can't wait to see it.
01:03:40
Yeah, he is. He's a big boy.
01:03:42
He's 63 and a half and 265 pounds of muscle.
01:03:45
I just did an interview the other day where they were, like,
01:03:47
are you mad? He read Ryan.
01:03:48
And I was like, no. Like if you can see, This is
01:03:50
interview, okay? I should just said yes.
01:03:53
I was like know if you can see me right now, believe me my wife
01:03:56
which is I looked more like Maddie red.
01:03:59
Okay what? But he talks the way I'm pretty
01:04:02
sure I would if I was six foot three, a half 265 pounds of
01:04:05
muscle, could get away with it. Okay.
01:04:06
So in that sense maybe but no I hope you guys liked it.
01:04:10
I hope my my true belief is if you like my trap, you'll see
01:04:15
enough in my character that maybe give them a try and you
01:04:17
like it, but Listen without Vince Flynn.
01:04:23
I'm not even coming on this. You know, podcast as as a rat
01:04:26
biologists as a books by or as an author.
01:04:30
Right? Well, how about this?
01:04:32
We want to go much deeper into fields of fire.
01:04:35
We want to hear more about lethal range and trust me.
01:04:38
We've got tons more. We could talk about with Mitch
01:04:40
rap. So how about we have we have you
01:04:42
back on sometime soon? Yeah and then down the road we
01:04:44
have you back on to talk lethal range closer to that Pub date in
01:04:48
2023. Yeah.
01:04:50
Yeah, I feel like barely scratch the surface guys like there's so
01:04:53
much more to talk about. We got it.
01:04:54
We're gonna have to do another part 2, part 3 part 4 on this
01:04:57
because we could end even get to ask you, you know, you put it on
01:05:01
the I guess, you know, we could just tell him to go read the
01:05:04
read your blog post, but I want to hear from your mouth, the
01:05:09
explaining the top 10 kills, you know, like that that you put out
01:05:12
there. So, yeah, there's a lot more we
01:05:15
work and we got it again and I love what you guys are doing by
01:05:17
the way. So, yeah, on behalf of all the
01:05:20
other men, Fans. Thank you.
01:05:21
We needed someone to do a podcast like this, and deep dive
01:05:24
it, man. I love what you guys are doing.
01:05:25
Please keep it up and let's let's do this again soon.
01:05:29
Definitely is awesome. Well, one last thing, thank you
01:05:31
for that, but for that praise. And before we let you go, we're
01:05:33
going to keep a No Limits tradition alive, which is to
01:05:36
send you off with your very own limerick.
01:05:40
He calls himself Ryan the rap ologist the real books by right
01:05:44
here in our midst, a true Vince Flynn scholar who can write
01:05:48
quite the brawler fields of fire.
01:05:51
A Maddie red novel, not to be missed.
01:05:53
Thanks for joining us. Ryan's dad, can't wait to have
01:05:55
you back. Thank you guys.
01:06:04
I hope you enjoyed that interview as much as we did next
01:06:07
week, you got to go over to our other feeds.
01:06:09
This feed will be going a little bit dormant, but go to a season
01:06:12
two, it's got heart bath pot, you get our part 2 of take down,
01:06:19
and go check out the No Limits to the podcast where we will be
01:06:22
bringing, you may be Savage Sun, definitely our interview with
01:06:25
Andrews and Wilson and a whole lot more to come.
01:06:27
So as always, we knew think our patrons are special operations.
01:06:31
A tertiary up our special agents Darryl, Kevin George Matt Dawn.
01:06:35
Dennis Peggy, Catherine, Ray Bridget, Jeff and Mark.
01:06:39
Please Subscribe. Rate interview using your
01:06:41
favorite podcast and platform. You can find us online at the
01:06:44
other pod.com, or on Twitter and Instagram at Thriller podcast.
01:06:49
And as always, just let Mitch be Mitch.