A Vince Flynn-esque race to the finish! Chris and mike break down Dark Fall - book #3 in the Shepherd Series by Andrews and Wilson.
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00:00:16
Hey, guys, I'm Chris. And I'm Mike.
00:00:20
And welcome back to this week's No Limits to their podcast.
00:00:24
How you doing today, Mike? I'm good ready to talk about the
00:00:29
final third of this book, and maybe only the final third of
00:00:32
this book. Yeah.
00:00:34
You know, it's kind of we, you know, I was expecting this to
00:00:39
happen after book 2. You know, like, you know, this
00:00:43
is a typical, I want to say typical, like a sophomore slump,
00:00:47
sophomore slump. But, you know, people take
00:00:51
swings and people have misses. And I think, wow, there's
00:00:56
Parsons book I liked, definitely my least favorite book of the
00:00:59
series. You were telling me to wait till
00:01:03
I get to the third. Wait till I get to the third.
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And I will agree with you that the third, last third of this
00:01:08
book is by far the best part of it.
00:01:13
But I don't think it saves. I don't think it does enough to
00:01:16
save it. Really.
00:01:18
OK, I, if you you remember the end of the last pod on Dark
00:01:23
Angel, we're blown away. We're like, yeah, no, no
00:01:26
sophomore slump. Great second book.
00:01:28
Second books are tough. Yet the characters are still
00:01:30
alive. Everything's still vibrant.
00:01:32
We got to the team stuff, the Trinity loop.
00:01:34
It all felt kind of new. This one doesn't do anything
00:01:37
new, and it tries to do new things that don't land.
00:01:41
The spy stuff in Hong Kong, the directed energy weapon, kind of
00:01:45
like this looming threat. It's basically just take Jack
00:01:48
Ryan book or take Scott Harvath book.
00:01:50
There's nukes on the loose. Let's we got to find them and it
00:01:53
just kind of plays into that old trope.
00:01:56
And I didn't really need that because this series is about
00:01:58
breathing fresh air into storytelling coming at it from a
00:02:01
different angle. Yet I feel like it just tried to
00:02:03
fit into these archetypes of nuke on the loose.
00:02:07
We need the spies to go catch the catch the bad guys and
00:02:09
interrogate them. And that doesn't work for, I
00:02:12
think, the universe that's been established.
00:02:14
Nuke on the loose, but also like we're we're trying to do A and
00:02:20
they even like mention it. You know, they're they're
00:02:22
they're not even like trying to hide it, but it's a Mission
00:02:24
Impossible S type stuff with this, you know, Star Wars death
00:02:29
ray type thing that ultimately didn't matter, you know.
00:02:33
It was all a red herring. Yeah, like.
00:02:36
I I will say like starting us in Peru with the attack with this
00:02:41
like shirt that is bone chilling.
00:02:44
But when you introduce something that's so OE like that and then
00:02:51
but you don't have superhero to go up against it.
00:02:55
It's different if that story is in The Avengers or is in, you
00:03:00
know, somewhere where we're we can the the there's equity on
00:03:06
the playing field. Like literally there's nothing
00:03:09
that these operators could do that I could buy that they could
00:03:14
believe. I, I didn't even believe, like,
00:03:17
I, I guess I didn't understand the rules of the game with this
00:03:19
weapon because ultimately it felt like it was, it was so
00:03:23
powerful, like so devastating. The fact that they have to, like
00:03:28
pretty much everyone has to go on lockdown.
00:03:31
They think they can't even travel out.
00:03:32
Then they even go a step further to say that, Oh yeah, by the
00:03:35
way, this weapon like doesn't even matter if you have cover
00:03:38
'cause it can take you out in a building.
00:03:41
It, it has the ability to take out the airplane, the pilot or
00:03:45
the computers or all three, like depending on which wavelength
00:03:48
you're at. Like that just really pissed me
00:03:53
off in the, in the sense that I don't know what it pissed me
00:03:56
off, but like you, just the, the use of that wasn't fulfilled.
00:04:02
It wasn't necessary. I, I felt like the way this sort
00:04:07
of escalation was going with Victor.
00:04:10
And I will agree, like ultimately, you know, the
00:04:13
culmination of him coming to Saint George's Academy, like
00:04:18
there needed to be that if if that didn't happen in this book,
00:04:21
I was going to be like up even more upset.
00:04:23
Yeah, you know, this this three book arc of having that.
00:04:27
And first of all, I'm super intrigued to see like where we
00:04:31
go next with this here next. It's wide open.
00:04:34
Wait, you could do whatever. Like do we go to Lucifer?
00:04:37
Like do we? Is there another, you know,
00:04:40
right hand man that that that we don't know about?
00:04:43
You know, like there's there's so many possibilities.
00:04:46
So I'm I'm still intrigued with the series, but yeah, like, I
00:04:51
don't know. I just it it rubbed me the wrong
00:04:53
way from the beginning. And then them trying to do this.
00:04:59
What does he say? Ethan Hutt, Jason Bourne, Stipe
00:05:03
stuff. Yeah, it was cool.
00:05:05
Yeah, it was funny. Like, you know, you throw in
00:05:07
like some of the humor and it's good.
00:05:09
But first of all, Jed's way out of his element seems like
00:05:13
everyone else's way out of their element.
00:05:14
And I just not, not the strength of what the first two books
00:05:19
were. You know, we, we, we weren't in
00:05:23
Victor's mind literally at all, like until the very end.
00:05:28
And I guess, I guess they they explained that away with he's
00:05:30
like working with this whole legion of, you know, it's not
00:05:35
just one demon that's inside of him.
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It's like, you know, thousands of of demons that are something
00:05:39
that allows him to mask versus the watchers.
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But what that does is it strips away a lot of the things that
00:05:45
we've liked about it, like going into his mind and, and, and
00:05:48
seeing that interaction. The Watchers.
00:05:50
The Watchers are completely taken out of the series until
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the very end, and until they're almost like, all right now
00:05:55
they're supposed to be the superheroes, which, yeah, it's
00:05:58
cool at the very end. Like that though.
00:06:01
You do you like that I? I do.
00:06:04
They are pissing off. You're sidelining like we are
00:06:06
best characters. They were sidelined, though.
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I feel like because Victor embodied all these demons, he
00:06:13
was the one focal point for all this negative energy, these
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demon spirits to focus and be able to kind of put a blanket
00:06:21
over the Watchers and blind them without them knowing they're
00:06:24
blinded. You know the whole quote about
00:06:27
Legion. We are many.
00:06:28
Well, I love that poetic ending of like, well, it took many in
00:06:31
prayer, the all the watchers in prayer together with Rachel to
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expel those demons. A little bit of a divide.
00:06:39
Does it change Victor's nature? Kinda at the 11th hour just for
00:06:42
some exciting drama to have that moment.
00:06:44
Yeah, I, I guess that that could be seen as a cop out, but it
00:06:48
also explains Victor's powers. I, I feel like you can look back
00:06:52
on everything Victor's done and realize why he's so powerful of
00:06:56
a demon spirit is he's channeling all these, you know,
00:07:01
lesser demons and he's controlling them.
00:07:03
And now he realized I can control them in order to defeat
00:07:07
the Watchers. It got kind of kind of like he
00:07:09
upped his strategy and antics and tactics because Sarah Beth's
00:07:13
been so good, because Corbin's been so good.
00:07:15
He's been a step behind and he hates being a step behind.
00:07:18
He finally leveraged his power, which was, you know, if you're
00:07:22
Legion, you are many, you can control the demons.
00:07:24
He finally found a way around the Watchers.
00:07:26
And I feel like he couldn't do that from the very beginning.
00:07:29
You couldn't have Victor come in and he's trying to take Sarah
00:07:31
Beth and all of a sudden he has this immense power to blind all
00:07:34
the Watchers and all this noetic and telepathic kind of stuff he
00:07:39
can just block out of nowhere. No, he had like build to that.
00:07:42
He was building his powers in response to the Watchers and the
00:07:45
Shepherds building their powers. So that part I'm OK with.
00:07:49
Everything else you said 100% valid. 100% agreed.
00:07:53
I do think the Saint George's scene does enough though.
00:07:57
It it definitely for me does enough to save the book.
00:08:01
It ends the trilogy. I was not having fun in the
00:08:06
first section of this book. I texted you in the middle.
00:08:08
I was a little frustrated at it, but damn did they do enough.
00:08:13
Going back to the frustrations, you're you.
00:08:15
Completely agree. There's two things I think I
00:08:17
would add. It's not just that this weapon
00:08:21
was so Opie and then it didn't matter anymore.
00:08:24
It was like also some weird things like how Nisha all of a
00:08:27
sudden becomes a spy and like I'm kind of intrigued by her
00:08:30
back story, the way Jed's like there's more to her.
00:08:33
She worked for some three letter agency at what did she do
00:08:35
beforehand? While I'm like half intrigued in
00:08:38
that it's so fake how they're writing it, how she's all buddy
00:08:41
buddy with these old spy cohorts and these people and she
00:08:45
operates so well with them and they look up to her and she's
00:08:47
into that. The the shepherds would have
00:08:50
wanted to use that knowledge and rely on it.
00:08:52
And they haven't for as long as we've known them.
00:08:54
So I, I didn't buy her being just fit in to be this super spy
00:08:59
in her past and her back story. I'm intrigued about her back
00:09:01
story, but just not the way it was expressed here.
00:09:04
Didn't fit. You had to lay a little more
00:09:07
groundwork to get that to be believable, you know, and I
00:09:11
understand if, like, all right, you didn't think of that until
00:09:13
this book, then, you know, that's something that you lay
00:09:16
pieces in this book to, you know, build upon in the future
00:09:20
or you put it, you should have thought of that and put it into
00:09:22
your other two books to they they do it very, very subtly,
00:09:27
but definitely not enough to have me buy in the OK.
00:09:30
She is literally, you know, the equivalent of the spy, you know,
00:09:35
a super spy, like even better than any of the spies we've read
00:09:39
before. And oh, another thing, like the
00:09:43
whole Rachel Yarnell, like Jedediah emotional baggage back
00:09:52
story. Gives him the business.
00:09:55
Was just like, to me, I don't know, this is going to might be
00:09:59
rude, but to me it was reminiscent of Mitch Rapp's
00:10:05
wife, Anna. Anna.
00:10:07
Like, yeah, like just this. She's just bitchy, annoying male
00:10:12
character who, you know, wants to be involved, can't like and I
00:10:18
guess in the end they try to salvage it with her.
00:10:20
Like she was the original watcher who Victor tried to, you
00:10:24
know, like they've they've put that in the series, but I don't
00:10:28
know her. She was just so annoying in this
00:10:31
book. It was, I don't know, maybe I'm
00:10:33
the only one, but like to me that was just super off putting.
00:10:39
I'm a little more lenient towards her because she's been
00:10:41
kind of isolated. Like David has his role, Jed has
00:10:44
his role, Sarah Beth has her role.
00:10:46
They're all going out, playing superhero, getting trained,
00:10:49
putting their skills to work. There's a freaking death ray on
00:10:52
the loose, right? Like, get over it.
00:10:55
OK, that's one thing. If it's like a normal OP, this
00:10:59
is like the opt to end all OPS. Like, see that?
00:11:02
I think that's the juxtaposition that I have a problem with.
00:11:05
You're going to bring this up when?
00:11:07
OK, Literally this thing could incinerate you while you're
00:11:10
sitting in your house drinking your tea.
00:11:13
Oh Boo Hoo, Boo Hoo me. Like I, I used to be a watcher.
00:11:17
Yeah, she's like, I want to go sit outside, let's go drink wine
00:11:20
outside or whatever. It's like, OK, a little
00:11:23
rebellious, you know, I don't know.
00:11:26
I could kind of feel she's been cooped up.
00:11:27
She's on Trinity Loop and and I think Maria plays on that
00:11:32
vulnerability, though she knows that's her in so I could play,
00:11:35
you know, sidekick. I could be friend, you know, I
00:11:37
could say I'm recovering from the bullet wound and I want a
00:11:39
little a friend to hang out with.
00:11:40
And I'm also bored, like you're bored.
00:11:42
Let's let's do things together. Pretty cool when Rachel reads
00:11:45
her mind though and you know the gig is up and Rachel doesn't let
00:11:49
her know the gig is up. And pretty dramatic too.
00:11:51
When Rachel wants to go to the school and Maria is driving her
00:11:55
and Maria every step of the way, you know she's going to be good.
00:11:59
In the end they I think they dropped enough.
00:12:03
Like really early on. Before, yeah, they they did that
00:12:06
really early on, but I think I think it's still worked.
00:12:11
And you still had the moment where Victor thinks she's on his
00:12:15
side and Sarah Beth is like devastated.
00:12:18
And everyone's like, Oh my God, how could you?
00:12:20
I should have known. And then she does the right
00:12:23
thing. So did you like Maria's arc in
00:12:26
the end? Yeah, but ultimately, what does
00:12:28
she do to stop Victor? Nothing like.
00:12:31
She slows him down. Let's Jed catch up.
00:12:33
For a like a second like that, That's my other problem that
00:12:36
like all this stuff is you're. Ruining it for me.
00:12:39
Yeah, I know, I know. Yeah, that's what I'm here for.
00:12:41
Like. Usually that's what I'm here
00:12:44
for, but. You know, it's like I see what
00:12:49
they were trying to go for in her arc, and I understand it.
00:12:52
There was plenty of foreshadowing that, you know,
00:12:55
this person who went to the dark, but ultimately, like had
00:12:59
some redeeming qualities that in the end they were able to, you
00:13:03
know, she, you know. But if that's the case and she
00:13:07
should have been the one to, I thought it would have been more
00:13:11
powerful if she was the one. She killed Victor.
00:13:13
Stop Victor. Well, like her sacrifice was the
00:13:16
reason like that. Ultimately, her sacrifice didn't
00:13:19
really mean anything because you needed Jed and you needed all
00:13:23
the Watchers to like, be there. I think.
00:13:25
I think it did though. I.
00:13:28
I am reading it wrong but. I think you're, I don't know, I,
00:13:31
I think you're discrediting it a little bit much because it, it
00:13:35
could think of Harry Potter, right.
00:13:37
Remember I told you it's a Harry Potter SC And I'm, I'm literally
00:13:39
thinking defending Hogwarts, defending St.
00:13:41
George when Michaela, when Josh, when they're all putting their
00:13:44
hands in and Josh takes the spear and they convince Michaela
00:13:47
on the fire escape. You know, don't be afraid.
00:13:49
You know, we got you. I think the only way you defeat
00:13:54
this evil is if every single person gives of themselves,
00:13:59
gives of their gifts, uses their abilities, sacrifices for one
00:14:03
another. And so if one of those people
00:14:06
didn't do it, Victor, Wayne, Jed's too slow.
00:14:09
Everyone's behind. You know, the timing of it had
00:14:12
to be right because every single person played their role.
00:14:18
So I, I don't know, I, I like when that happens.
00:14:20
It's like if Joshua didn't bring the spear, if Michaela wasn't
00:14:23
there to help them pray at the end, if Corbin didn't pull.
00:14:26
Dude when Corbin pulls the spear out.
00:14:27
That was intense. You think she's absolutely done.
00:14:30
You think like, because Jed thinks like, oh, she's OK as
00:14:33
long as she doesn't pull the spear out and then she does it.
00:14:35
And then she. Needs it, yeah.
00:14:38
You don't even know. It's kind of left unclear if
00:14:40
both Corbin and Johnny, like Ken, Ben's powers heal them.
00:14:43
And then we get hints at the end that yes, Ben, yeah.
00:14:46
How did you feel about that that that that Johnny is saved?
00:14:51
I thought, yeah, I don't know. I don't.
00:14:53
I thought it would have been a good way to write them off.
00:14:56
I agree. Him and Jed had their
00:15:00
reconciliation moment and for him to give up to sacrifice, you
00:15:05
know, say like he checked two things off of his bucket list at
00:15:07
the very end. Like I thought that was a
00:15:10
perfect way to end his story. I agree.
00:15:13
And then to just pull the again the OP card of Ben can can heal
00:15:18
him. I don't know, at the end he like
00:15:19
brought it, made his sacrifice a little bit less for me.
00:15:23
Yeah, especially after Jed had the talk, I liked how he would
00:15:26
like, follow Jed into battle and Jed listen to him in the heart
00:15:29
of battle. He's like, what's your idea?
00:15:31
And I like how they mended everything.
00:15:32
And it's like once they do that. That's what you do in a story
00:15:35
when you have this conflict. He goes out like you mend it and
00:15:38
then the very end that mending is what allows the team to
00:15:42
succeed. To win, but at a cost.
00:15:45
A cost at a cost, right? At a cost.
00:15:47
The stakes. The stakes were so high, yet in
00:15:49
the end, the stakes didn't even matter because everybody's fine.
00:15:53
I understand Corbin. Like, that's a classic move of
00:15:56
of, you know, sort of pulling the wool about her rugs and
00:16:00
then, oh, we think she's dead and then she doesn't.
00:16:01
Like I was fine with Corbin living like she.
00:16:04
Had to survive. I agree.
00:16:05
Two major of a character. But but Johnny, I don't know,
00:16:10
maybe they said something about that, but we are in in the
00:16:14
series time and time again. There's just there's moments in
00:16:17
times where deaths can mean so much more and there's so much
00:16:23
more impactful and it just it adds more nuance to the story.
00:16:27
It adds more meaning to the story.
00:16:29
You know, I think that's why people like, you know, the
00:16:33
stories of George RR Martin where he's, he's not afraid, you
00:16:37
know, or, or these other series where, where, where they're not
00:16:39
afraid to have the ultimate sacrifice.
00:16:43
Because ultimately I think that puts us on edge that, hey,
00:16:47
everyone is kind of expendable. You know, it, it, it kind of
00:16:50
this leads us back to other series where, OK, we know these
00:16:55
guys are, are going to make it through.
00:16:57
And sometimes that, you know, it, it changes the way I read
00:17:02
things, right? You know, like when I, when I
00:17:05
know that they're going to succeed, I, I guess you know,
00:17:08
then ultimately you're like, OK, I'm fine.
00:17:11
Yeah, I agree. Don't tell me though, you didn't
00:17:13
love the Hogwarts scenes. Running through the hallways,
00:17:16
opening the elevator, the secret room.
00:17:20
All that I, I loved, I, I thought that as soon as we hit
00:17:26
like after, well, I, I did find the, the scene where Jed and Eli
00:17:31
have to land the plane, like super intense and super
00:17:34
riveting. Like, you know, a, a lot of
00:17:37
times. And I feel like some of our
00:17:39
other authors would make it so like Jed and Eli could just land
00:17:45
the plane like no questions asked.
00:17:47
I mean, it, it, it's definitely shows the vulnerability of these
00:17:50
two that, yeah, they're fierce operators, but one who is like
00:17:55
trained to jump out of plane, has done so many jumps, is
00:17:58
actually afraid of flying. And the other one is scared
00:18:01
shitless too land a plane, you know, like he's been a Delta or
00:18:05
a SEAL operator for 20 years or almost 20 years, and yet he
00:18:11
still has fears. I, I, I enjoy that moment.
00:18:13
While, you know, it's a little like the whole like culmination
00:18:17
to that scene is really ridiculous.
00:18:18
The fact that they're able to pull this other plane up to the
00:18:20
plane undetected and manoeuvre that again, Mission Impossible
00:18:25
type stuff. Yeah, you.
00:18:27
Don't need the Ethan Hunt stuff because what was so impressive
00:18:30
in this universe is Ben being able to get inside the pilot's
00:18:35
head and plant the seeds. You already had that.
00:18:38
That is evil. You already had that.
00:18:39
You didn't need other. Yeah, I think you leverage that
00:18:44
kind of stuff. You, you leverage that, you
00:18:47
know, noetic connection he has to this other guy, this
00:18:49
consciousness. And like, that's how we kind of
00:18:52
save this thing and get out of the jam and make that very high
00:18:54
stakes. Like, what if Ben's inside this
00:18:57
guy's head instead of like, repressurizing the cabin so they
00:19:01
can do this. Ethan Hunt, enter the plane.
00:19:02
Oh thing, you just have him inside his head.
00:19:05
Shoot the copilot. Shoot the copilot, tie up the
00:19:09
copilot like you totally use those skills and then the the
00:19:12
main pilot's like he snaps out of it, right?
00:19:14
He almost starts blocking Ben subconsciously and the tension
00:19:18
is like, is he going to block out Ben or is Ben going to get
00:19:21
through? Is Ben's skills going to work?
00:19:23
And then Ben has to call on another watcher and they do it
00:19:24
together. So now this guy has two voices
00:19:27
in his head and it's like that. The final moment saves it.
00:19:29
I didn't need the other ridiculous action of boarding
00:19:32
the plane, although the landing it again kind of saved it
00:19:35
because it was fun. It was intense.
00:19:38
But that was also where I was not bought in because I, I
00:19:41
wasn't in on the Hong Kong app. Hong Kong app, you got to catch
00:19:46
the scientist. I couldn't even track.
00:19:48
Like they know the scientist worked on the weapon.
00:19:51
He didn't know everything, but he knew enough.
00:19:53
Or they had another guy who then gave up this scientist.
00:19:55
He like recognized him from some a drawing that Corbin did or
00:19:59
something. And that was when Nisha had to
00:20:01
be your whole spy thing and they had to escape.
00:20:04
And do they the ambulance switch?
00:20:05
They they put these two ambulances in a way that no one
00:20:07
could see that they moved one body out of the other and
00:20:10
switched it with the other guy. That was first of all super
00:20:12
confusing. I didn't understand how it even
00:20:14
happened. Me neither.
00:20:16
I wasn't bought into that. This would be the team doing
00:20:18
that like we went to Peru. I get you're trying to do the
00:20:21
international thing. I I wasn't even sure why the
00:20:23
team had to be on the ground in Peru to be honest with you.
00:20:27
See you, you're doing the international thing.
00:20:29
I didn't need the Hong Kong also and then to that to lead into
00:20:34
the New Jersey scene and all of a sudden now it's an attack on
00:20:37
the White House and the president in the Rose Garden for
00:20:40
no reason. And the action is they're going
00:20:42
to use this weapon over DC flying from New Jersey.
00:20:46
I was so not bought into the whole storyline.
00:20:48
I'm just like, go to Saint George's.
00:20:50
What are Sarah Beth and Corbin doing?
00:20:52
And another one, dude, what the hell is David doing?
00:20:56
This book was at the OK. The first book is the watcher
00:21:00
book. You learn all about watchers,
00:21:01
who they are. You know, it opens with a priest
00:21:03
in the bookstore with Corbin. Who are the watchers?
00:21:05
What do they do? The second book, who are the
00:21:08
shepherds? What do they do?
00:21:09
Trinity Loop, this book really needed to lean into the TS LS,
00:21:13
who they are, what they do, why they're necessary.
00:21:16
And there was never that pay off.
00:21:18
Like the only pay off of ATSL was book 2 where David at one
00:21:22
moment gives Jed strength. You know, when he really tells
00:21:25
him, I believed in you Jed, like you were our protector.
00:21:28
I know you you blame yourself for what happened to Rachel that
00:21:30
night, but you have always been the protector and we need you to
00:21:33
be the protector and that's who you are in your DNA.
00:21:36
You know, he says reach out and he reads gospel to him.
00:21:39
He's like gospel says reach out and Jed in the middle of a fight
00:21:42
is able to take that advice and win the battle.
00:21:46
David does absolutely nothing here but cower on that plane.
00:21:51
I, I I don't know if he was fully utilized or even if the TS
00:21:55
LS has been utilized. Honestly, I don't even know.
00:21:58
I don't even know at this at this book kind of makes me
00:22:01
question what what the point of them are.
00:22:05
I agree. When Dark Angel did give me
00:22:07
enough, the last book gave me enough to want to say, OK,
00:22:09
they're an integral part of the team.
00:22:11
You had to lean into it and they didn't.
00:22:14
I do think another opportunity here is David wasn't able to
00:22:19
protect Sarah Beth twice and dark Intercept.
00:22:24
He says on the plane, there's no way in hell I'm not going in and
00:22:29
and not going to be able to protect her this time at Saint
00:22:31
George's. And I get the jet has to tell
00:22:35
him, but you can't do this jump. It's a low altitude, low opening
00:22:38
jump. If it's so dangerous, I wanted
00:22:41
David to say, you know, F all, give me the parachute and jump
00:22:45
the hell out of the plane himself.
00:22:47
And then someone else has to tandem, right?
00:22:49
Jump on to him tandem and he'll be like, you idiot.
00:22:51
You could have got us killed. And he's like, screw you.
00:22:54
And he just starts running and takes off right.
00:22:56
Then the battle of the berm happens, right?
00:22:58
Johnny goes down, Becks has to stay with him.
00:23:01
Eli and Jed battle, you know, blowing things up, and then
00:23:04
they're distracting these demons.
00:23:06
Then Jed finally gets into the building.
00:23:08
But the whole time, David, since he's not an operative, was just
00:23:12
like, quietly sneaking in, you know, like he found an extra
00:23:16
passageway. She's like, I wasn't going to
00:23:17
let my daughter go to the school without seeing the architectural
00:23:20
plans and pouring over it. And he knew some secret passage
00:23:22
or whatever. And David saved us a day.
00:23:25
Like I think there needs to be an opportunity for David to be
00:23:28
his daughter's hero. And yet she's just sitting there
00:23:32
thinking Uncle Jed, Uncle Jed come save me.
00:23:33
And then he does and Uncle Jed turns the corner and fights
00:23:35
Victor. I thought it was a missed
00:23:38
opportunity because we've done that 3-4 times or whatever.
00:23:41
Uncle Jed saved me. I was like, David, let the let
00:23:44
the dad come in and I think that needs to happen or it's going to
00:23:48
boil over. I know you did all this work to,
00:23:50
like, supplant that he's needed, You know, if not, then you
00:23:54
should just had Jed be her dad, you know, like in the story,
00:23:59
like. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:24:02
It's very interesting. Yeah.
00:24:04
There's, there's just, there's too many holes in this book man
00:24:06
to like. You're right.
00:24:09
Oh another big one. I don't know if I bought into
00:24:11
the Sodom stuff of like the directed energy weapon would
00:24:15
scare humanity into believing God doesn't exist and losing all
00:24:18
hope. It's like, no, it's a freaking
00:24:20
laser space weapon. Like it's not this big religious
00:24:23
analogy of everyone in the world.
00:24:25
Christians are going to stop believing because there's a
00:24:27
Direct Energy weapon. They're just going to paint
00:24:29
their roofs blue and everybody's fine and Maui doesn't or you
00:24:32
know, the whole paint your roof blue thing.
00:24:35
You know this conspiracy. Theory.
00:24:37
I've heard about that. Like we we don't the Sodom and
00:24:40
Gomorrah stuff. I just, I wasn't jiving with it.
00:24:43
Didn't give me buy into the scariness of the weapon.
00:24:46
The weapon is deadly enough as it is.
00:24:49
I did not buy that. You had to.
00:24:51
You had. You had to force this religious
00:24:53
component into the weapon. I didn't buy any of it.
00:24:58
And I think, all right, if you're going to use his weapon,
00:25:02
lean into the weapon. Lean into the weapon like it
00:25:05
was. It was a red herring.
00:25:06
It was a side. Show you you trialled it in this
00:25:09
super remote village in Peru. You have no reaction from anyone
00:25:16
besides, you know, the people that we're used to like the
00:25:19
president isn't brought in the the news media isn't brought in
00:25:24
like have another attack, have an attack like on a, on a, like
00:25:29
a whole community at a church. Like, well, the Rose garden one
00:25:32
would have been that. I mean, that's that's that's
00:25:35
you're escalating from trialling it at a remote village in Peru
00:25:38
to boom, we're now going to take that's a like the white.
00:25:41
House. That's a jump.
00:25:42
That's a jump, yeah. I don't know.
00:25:46
And the fact that they they know that they saw multiple boxes in
00:25:50
that one fake thing, but yet they're super blindsided by the
00:25:54
fact that we're going to send all of our firepower after this
00:25:58
one and then boom, there's going to be a bunch.
00:26:00
So now we're spread all across the world and we're going to
00:26:02
we're going to leave Trinity Loop and the watchers like
00:26:06
exposed to me that. Wouldn't you just have three
00:26:09
planes going over DC, each one with a different one of these
00:26:11
weapons as a fail safe as you know some redundancy?
00:26:15
And then what happened to the other planes?
00:26:19
Yeah, I don't know. I don't.
00:26:20
And at that point, once once they're compromised, wouldn't
00:26:23
Victor just say, OK, all right, we can't get Philadelphia.
00:26:27
Let's light up Exton PA because we're are the planes already
00:26:32
that you know, like. I didn't understand the physics.
00:26:34
I didn't understand the physics of the weapon either.
00:26:36
You had to be at a certain altitude, a certain distance.
00:26:39
The size of the weapon has to be mobile.
00:26:41
But I I didn't understand the weapon.
00:26:45
I didn't like the weapon and it didn't make sense to me.
00:26:47
You forced a religious component to it.
00:26:49
Nothing worked with that. The weapon was the worst part of
00:26:52
this book. Nothing worked.
00:26:54
It worst part of this book, which kind of cheapens the Peru
00:26:57
stuff. Like the Peru opening scene was
00:27:00
kind of interesting when I read about it without knowing what's
00:27:03
to come. Going back to the Peru stuff on
00:27:06
reread, I was like, none of this actually matters.
00:27:09
And then chasing down the weapon, oh, this doesn't matter
00:27:12
either. And finding a scientist, this
00:27:13
doesn't matter. The planes in New Jersey doesn't
00:27:15
matter, doesn't matter. I was like, can we just get to
00:27:17
the Saint George's stuff? Already.
00:27:18
Yeah, yeah, really. Seriously.
00:27:20
Yeah. The only thing that I like from
00:27:22
like the Peru stuff was when like Jed goes half cocked and
00:27:29
starts chasing that one Dark 1 and they actually are able to
00:27:32
take him. The interrogation with the dark
00:27:35
one like that was intense. That's true.
00:27:38
The exorcism, like essentially an exorcism like all that was
00:27:42
cool. And like I guess we're again
00:27:44
building lore within this system.
00:27:46
So, you know, there's bits and pieces that I like as we go
00:27:50
throughout. But ultimately you're correct.
00:27:52
None of that stuff in the end mattered because Victor was
00:27:58
going to go you. You could have had any other
00:28:04
like scenario to get the shepherds spread throughout the
00:28:07
world. That would have been
00:28:10
exponentially more believable than this death ray.
00:28:14
Yeah. When ultimately your main goal
00:28:16
was to set up this confrontation at Saint George's with Victor.
00:28:20
Like we knew that was coming. If they if they didn't come, we
00:28:23
would have been pissed off. And they execute that amazingly.
00:28:26
But I don't know, to me, it just doesn't to For you, it does
00:28:30
salvage the book. I guess for me it does salvage
00:28:33
the book like to it's no longer a dud, but it doesn't do enough
00:28:38
for me to like elevate this. It's definitely not elevating
00:28:41
this book over the 1st 2:00. Yeah, no, it's, it's definitely
00:28:46
in 3rd place. And I thought that ending did
00:28:50
enough to make me say it's still a good book.
00:28:54
Oh, I'll put it this way. The ending is a great and
00:28:57
fitting end to the trilogy, to the Victor arc and the Murray
00:29:01
arc. I like that part.
00:29:04
Bring it back in with the other two books.
00:29:07
I think that the ending is needed and it's it.
00:29:10
It does a good job at at finishing this three book arc,
00:29:14
but the first 2/3 of this book are just like.
00:29:18
Not a great book but it has a good ending to the trilogy so I
00:29:23
like that it's a refresh. I think the Victor Maria stuff
00:29:26
had to end. I think with both of them being
00:29:28
out of the picture is great. And I don't know what you do,
00:29:33
but like we said before, it's wide open.
00:29:34
I do think you have to come back to the plant of I think you
00:29:37
could finally make the series go a little bit more political,
00:29:40
something with the shepherds being outed, their mission told
00:29:43
to the world or an evil one in DC.
00:29:45
So it's not like we just have to make.
00:29:47
This small reference to the fact that the DNI is like a major
00:29:52
benefactor. So like, wait, is is the DNI an
00:29:54
actual? Is he a shepherd?
00:29:55
Is he part of the organization? Yeah, they do say that.
00:29:58
So it would be cool if like government agencies,
00:30:00
intelligence community is so in bed with the shepherds, but then
00:30:04
politics, legislative, you know, all the other parts of
00:30:07
government are infiltrated by the dark ones.
00:30:10
Particularly we know there's this congressman.
00:30:12
What if he starts, you know, wanted running for president?
00:30:14
What if he becomes speaker? You know, what if he's in in
00:30:16
charge of a very important committee?
00:30:18
I really think you could start going that way.
00:30:21
That plus the TS LS it, I, I think if you don't do something
00:30:24
like that or you don't have the TS, LS play a much more
00:30:26
integral, integral role, you know, my interest could be
00:30:31
waning so. Let's do it, yeah.
00:30:37
Let's do it. All right, action susceptions,
00:30:44
all right. If if we were going basically
00:30:45
solely on the the third part of the book, it's a 10.
00:30:50
It's a 10 out of 10. But for me, I'm going to knock
00:30:54
it down to points. It's an 8 for me.
00:30:56
It's pretty high, OK, I I think though.
00:30:59
The ending is like is elevating that for me.
00:31:03
This is going to be the highest category possibly of.
00:31:05
Yeah, and then the plot, I'm, I'm digging it even more so.
00:31:08
Let me go 8 then with you on action suspense, just because I
00:31:11
think this is where we're going to make up ground because from
00:31:14
here on out, folks, it's not going to be a pretty ride.
00:31:17
Yeah, because for me like the plot is like a six and coupled
00:31:20
with that the buy in is like a like a two.
00:31:23
I, I I I want to go like almost one but that that seems too low
00:31:27
for me. Yeah, 66 and 2 is pretty fair,
00:31:34
but I got to go higher on buy in just because I I I couldn't put
00:31:38
it down at the end. I was really having a good time
00:31:40
with it. The plot though, I could
00:31:43
honestly go even lower than a six.
00:31:46
Yeah, the plot, you can go like a 5 or 64456, it's right now.
00:31:50
No, I'll go, I'll go 5. I think a four could be in play,
00:31:53
but I'll go, I'll go A5. I'm changing my to the five too.
00:31:57
OK, yeah, I I think we were trying trying to be a little too
00:32:00
generous. Here, I think just everything
00:32:01
that we brought up, you know, like the fact that 2/3 of this
00:32:06
book ultimately doesn't matter says something a lot about the
00:32:09
plot, you know? I agree.
00:32:11
I agree. I think bad guys, I, I don't
00:32:15
really know anything new. Maybe, maybe what gives a point
00:32:19
back to Bad guys for me is when Sarah Beth sees Victor as a boy.
00:32:25
Yeah. Did you?
00:32:26
Did you like that? Was that a?
00:32:28
Thing to you, I did I, I think it's I think it's been done
00:32:31
before. I think it's rehashing.
00:32:32
Sure. Yeah, yeah.
00:32:33
But at the same time, it makes sense for this series, I think.
00:32:37
At some point, you know, like. At at some point we had to learn
00:32:40
who Victor really is, and knowing the Christian roots of
00:32:42
the story, we we had to realize Victor is ultimately A
00:32:45
sympathetic character. Victor's human side.
00:32:49
Victor's human side. Not the legion of demons he
00:32:51
commands or the ones who converted him, but I think
00:32:55
seeing the little boy who went through so much trauma, who saw
00:32:59
men of faith, people of faith, put who is it his mother to
00:33:02
death violently. Yeah, exactly.
00:33:06
Kind of like Salem witch witch trial stuff.
00:33:08
I think that was unfortunately the only new thing we learned
00:33:13
about the villains and Victor. But it was a good enough thing
00:33:16
to learn about the villains that I can go, oh, I think a force
00:33:21
too kind. Yeah.
00:33:24
But because of that it gives it half a point.
00:33:25
So 3 1/2 I would go 3 but but but getting in Victor's head I
00:33:29
think earns back that half a point.
00:33:31
Yeah, I'll see you with that. I, I think, you know, we already
00:33:35
gave Victor the high praise in the 1st 2 novels and you have to
00:33:39
do something in order to get that four or five again, you
00:33:42
have to level up. And I, I think that you're
00:33:47
right. The only thing we get is like a
00:33:49
a very glimpse peek at his back story.
00:33:55
Yeah, 3 1/2. Well done by McLeod Andrews
00:33:57
though to do a Victor voice as a totally different as just a boy
00:34:01
talking to Sarah Beth and. I don't know what he sometimes
00:34:04
he's using, like I don't know if it's a synthesizer or something,
00:34:07
but man, the audio book on this thing is awesome.
00:34:10
So good. Cloud Andrews does a great job.
00:34:13
It's so good. That could be the free space.
00:34:14
Every single book, you know, the audio books are phenomenal.
00:34:19
Good guys Nisha brings. It's so sad because Nisha last
00:34:23
book brought it up like Nisha would be a six out of five last
00:34:26
book. This book I don't I want to know
00:34:29
her back story. I believe she maybe was with
00:34:32
NSACIA whoever, but I just don't believe how that is told to me.
00:34:37
It's too like didactic. It's like telling you.
00:34:39
It just wants you to believe that's just telling you it and
00:34:43
it's not authentic. The conversation she's having
00:34:45
during that whole I'm going to take over as this like last
00:34:48
book, she was the operator. Jed wanted her at the Vatican on
00:34:51
his. I know, like he said, all of a
00:34:53
sudden he doesn't trust her as the operator.
00:34:55
She's always like, you're better on the comms.
00:34:57
Yeah, he's like you're you're better sifting through Intel.
00:35:00
No, I make that back, Sir. Make that someone random.
00:35:02
She's not the one who's better at sifting through Intel.
00:35:05
And like she's sitting in an office.
00:35:06
Direct I I felt like they were they were pinning her up to be
00:35:09
the best of both and this book, they tried to make her take a
00:35:11
step back on the whole, on the whole operator side.
00:35:14
I didn't. I didn't believe it.
00:35:17
Me neither. So that Dings at a point, Josh
00:35:21
and Michaela and the team, the team of watchers gives me a
00:35:25
point at The Avengers assemble moment.
00:35:28
So I think I end up at a 3 1/2 again.
00:35:33
OK, I was going to go for it, OK.
00:35:35
Mainly because I thought I love the Johnny piece.
00:35:38
Like putting aside the whole yeah, yeah, you should have
00:35:41
killed him. What?
00:35:42
I mean, Yeah, yeah, All right. Whatever.
00:35:44
But I do think they played that because they've been building
00:35:46
that up. Right.
00:35:47
Yeah. For two books now.
00:35:50
Yeah. And finally they had that
00:35:53
confrontation. And I thought that that, that
00:35:57
that played very well. I I also think like that the
00:36:00
relationship between Eli and Jed was it grew strengthened and,
00:36:06
and deepened in this novel, you know, and it was a you learn a
00:36:10
little bit more about like, oh, I guess like Eli's also been
00:36:14
there a long time and he's a super like, why was he passed
00:36:16
over? And, but, but he, unlike Johnny,
00:36:19
just clicked. And to me he was almost like the
00:36:24
my, you know, spoiler word. He was my, my winner of the
00:36:28
book, like a little bit like just the, the stuff that he does
00:36:33
and the vulnerability he shows at the very end.
00:36:36
He's he's with there with Jed. He I thought he was dead.
00:36:40
Like when, when Victor like picks him up and throws him and
00:36:43
they say his like neck is, is like, you know, limp.
00:36:46
And I'm like, holy shit, did you you not only did you kill, I
00:36:49
thought like all these guys were.
00:36:50
I thought Cordman was dead. I thought Eli was dead.
00:36:52
I thought Maria. Maria, obviously was dead.
00:36:55
Snaps Maria's neck and she just goes down the wall.
00:36:57
Yeah. Slides down the wall.
00:36:58
Yeah, I thought all these. I thought the the other little
00:37:01
kid Josh was dead. Like yo, he.
00:37:02
Tosses Michaela Sarah Beth is running away and he tosses her
00:37:06
and she's like did he just toss a girl a.
00:37:08
Body at me, Yeah. Stop me, Yeah, yeah.
00:37:13
So I'm I'm gonna go for, I'm gonna go for a good guess.
00:37:16
OK, yeah, I think I'll stay 3 1/2.
00:37:18
But you're right, Johnny's Johnny's arc there to come
00:37:20
around and then Eli becoming a main player because I wondered
00:37:24
about Eli and it's just mission before self.
00:37:27
You know, Johnny had like that ego to be like, it's not fair.
00:37:30
Eli deserves this is not fair. And Eli was just able to rise
00:37:34
above that. Yeah, here's a great quote.
00:37:37
Like like if, if today is the day that I'm even maker, I'm
00:37:40
ready. I serve him like you know, he
00:37:43
when they're about to take that lilo jump.
00:37:45
So. Yeah, no, he's, he's like the
00:37:48
definition of like service, like servant leader setting.
00:38:00
It's a tough one. It's the same kind of story.
00:38:03
We've been saying I love St. George's.
00:38:04
I felt like it was Hogwarts. I felt that we got the most,
00:38:08
like, new information about Saint George's, like learning
00:38:11
about the sanctuary and the White Room and, you know, these
00:38:14
various dormitories and in the talk and like, all that kind of
00:38:19
stuff. Like I, I could visualize all
00:38:20
that in my head. And yeah, like you're saying
00:38:22
like Hogwarts vibes nonstop. That's a 5 out of five.
00:38:27
It's just I hated New Jersey. I hated Hong.
00:38:29
Kong. Everything else.
00:38:32
Peru was. Didn't really like me.
00:38:34
We could have been in Dubai during the Hong Kong scene, like
00:38:38
it, it didn't could have been anywhere.
00:38:40
A little, a little bit of like work to try to like set us up
00:38:43
with the whole the harbour and a little bit the New Jersey stuff
00:38:49
was why are you in Atlantic City?
00:38:51
It didn't make any sense to me. Why do they have to go to
00:38:54
Atlantic City? Yeah.
00:38:56
It didn't make any sense. Peru.
00:39:00
Yeah. OK.
00:39:02
Hong Kong, New Jersey, or. I think a three.
00:39:05
Peru is like a three and Saint George is a 5.
00:39:08
So yeah, let's go. Through the.
00:39:10
Middle. Yeah, I think I'm what?
00:39:13
I'm half a point. No, yeah, I'm half a point up
00:39:15
right now from my buy in. Yeah.
00:39:17
Boost, you know, free space. I got one for you.
00:39:23
Easily could be Johnny or Eli. Mine's Eli for sure.
00:39:27
I'm going to add Sanderson. Oh, that's a good one.
00:39:30
The guard Sanderson was great. And when Jed?
00:39:34
First out of the birds like yeah, yeah.
00:39:37
He's like this guy might be able to be a shepherd like a like a
00:39:39
full on like move up, send him out in the field down range
00:39:42
Shepherd, not just a a gate guard, but again, servant
00:39:45
leadership. He did his job.
00:39:47
He he did it very well. And when the attack was
00:39:50
happening, he gave it his all. He gave it everything.
00:39:54
I paid the price, the ultimate price, but but he gave it
00:39:56
everything. And it's it's heartbreaking at
00:39:58
the end, after what Jed's been through, he's like, and also,
00:40:03
you know, I give my gratitude to that gay guard.
00:40:05
I can't even remember his name right now.
00:40:06
I'm so tired and he just passes out.
00:40:09
So Sanderson like gets his moment of recognition, but
00:40:11
everything just went so to shit that he can't even think of his
00:40:14
name. But I think that's just real.
00:40:16
I think that's just showing the grittiness, the dark nature of
00:40:19
this. But Sanderson was awesome.
00:40:21
Great character, a good one. That's a good one.
00:40:24
That in the sphere, Josh grabbing the spear.
00:40:26
For me, I think it's like an Eli Johnny combo, like having those
00:40:31
two other and as well as Yoon, I think he was the best part of
00:40:36
the whole Hong Kong stuff. Like I thought that his
00:40:38
character was, was pretty well set, you know, like I, I, I was
00:40:43
fully bought in that he would have been the one doing that
00:40:46
kind of stuff. Becks too, you know, Becks was
00:40:49
good. I felt like we fleshed out her a
00:40:51
little bit more like this medic. She's, you know, but she can
00:40:54
ride or die with everyone like the team, the team is solid and
00:40:58
just getting a little bit more of that was was great.
00:40:59
So. Yeah, I think the way you
00:41:02
brought up all those two, I forgot about you.
00:41:03
And he's he's even a bit of Comic Relief on the Hong Kong OP
00:41:07
keep saying that. So I think I'm going to go 4.
00:41:09
I'm going to I'm going to get back that half a point on good
00:41:11
guys, then I'm going back to good guys with with a four.
00:41:15
Yeah, Becks too. I forgot she was great cover
00:41:20
time. It's actually a good one.
00:41:25
It's probably the best out of the three.
00:41:29
I'm I'm going to have to say that this fireball all right, so
00:41:35
first of all, why is it helicopters, though?
00:41:38
Well, that lay low jump. They're not in helicopters,
00:41:42
they're in an airplane, right? Oh, that's true.
00:41:44
God damn it. They had airplanes last time.
00:41:47
I know when they were in helicopters.
00:41:48
Now they have helicopters when they were in airplanes.
00:41:50
Oh shoot, you're right. Wow, you just keep bringing me
00:41:55
down tonight, my man. I came into this thinking like.
00:41:58
Having this. Low 40s.
00:42:00
Castle like fortress, obviously you have something that looks
00:42:04
like some sort of like on the one thing that's that's some
00:42:07
sort of vehicle right that they're in front of so that that
00:42:09
could be the APC. You know two kitted up operators
00:42:13
like I fully get like that is believable and the same thing
00:42:16
with with the other one like this is obviously St.
00:42:19
George's you know, you have this, although I don't know why
00:42:24
it should be sunny. It should be more like like
00:42:25
this, because I I love the fact this giant storm is coming and
00:42:30
like to me, I was like, is is Victor bringing the storm or is
00:42:34
it just, you know, coincidence, right like that you didn't
00:42:37
really know like what what was happening, but.
00:42:39
Yeah, that was cool. That adds to setting a little
00:42:41
bit. That was that was a cool fact.
00:42:44
What do we give on the covers? Alaska.
00:42:48
I think threes both times, No 3 and 3 1/2 maybe this one almost
00:42:54
builds on the good parts of Dark Angel and makes it even a little
00:42:57
better, but we. Gave threes on both.
00:42:58
Oh. We did all right then.
00:43:01
This one's a 3 1/2. This is a 3 1/2.
00:43:03
It's not quite a four. I was going to say, if we gave
00:43:05
one of them a 3 1/2, we'd have to give this one A4.
00:43:07
And a four to go up, yeah. But it it does something a
00:43:11
little bit more for me. But man, bringing up those
00:43:14
helicopters when they're in airplanes, that's tough.
00:43:16
Just swap the at. Least they have St.
00:43:18
George's. At least they have that.
00:43:20
Yeah, yeah, yes, it's true. If they didn't have St.
00:43:22
George's, I'd go much lower. It's Battle of the Berms.
00:43:26
It really just looks like it. Tough one tonight, Chris.
00:43:31
A little bit of a tough one. But I'll bet.
00:43:34
All right, So what? I got a 34.
00:43:36
What do you have, Mike? Then I should be one point
00:43:40
higher. They're 35.
00:43:42
Yeah, 35 OK, tough pill to swallow.
00:43:46
It's about 10 points lower. I gave Dark Angel A-44, you gave
00:43:52
it a 45. I gave Dark Intercept a 45.5 and
00:44:01
you gave Dark Angel Dark Intercept to 46.
00:44:06
Yeah. Big fall, but I kind of figured
00:44:10
this was going to be. I knew it was going to crack 30.
00:44:13
Yeah. Wasn't quite sure if it was
00:44:14
going to crack 40 but you know. Yeah.
00:44:17
Kind of makes sense. It's like right there.
00:44:20
Not. Completely trash but.
00:44:22
No, not, no, not by any means. But the numbers do indicate how
00:44:26
I remember feeling on my first reads of all of these.
00:44:30
I remember being so high on Dark Intercept.
00:44:33
I remember saying, oh, the second book was also really
00:44:36
good, Like I like that. And then I remember the third
00:44:38
book was like, oh, what are we doing here?
00:44:41
I'm not sure about this. So I do remember and that's why
00:44:44
when we did Dark Intercept, I was like, Chris, we'll see how
00:44:47
the next few go. And I was a little hesitant
00:44:50
because I remember a bit of a drop off.
00:44:55
It's a little bit more of a drop off than I recall, but but at
00:44:58
the same time, Dark Angel was better than I recalled.
00:45:01
I Dark Angel on reread I liked even more than I remembered.
00:45:05
Dark Fall on reread I liked a little less.
00:45:07
Than I a little less OK. Except for the ending of course,
00:45:10
as I. Said now we're but you're not
00:45:12
reading it with like a different, you know, the critics
00:45:14
eye in the sense. No, it's true.
00:45:17
It's true. Covering it for the bonds.
00:45:19
I stand by though everything in the Saint Georges attack was one
00:45:22
of the most fun rides I've had in a while.
00:45:24
Reading an action scene and when you talk about character arcs,
00:45:31
if you're trying to do a trilogy and wrap it up, if there were
00:45:34
loose ends of characters who you knew had to meet and you were
00:45:37
anticipating the meeting. Maria who who, who's good, who's
00:45:41
bad? We're going to find out in the
00:45:42
final battle. It better be something epic.
00:45:44
The backdrop, like you said with the lightning better be epic.
00:45:47
The setting at the school, you know, wherever it is, might
00:45:49
needs to be epic. The the villain has to has to be
00:45:53
a big bad. You can't have a villain who
00:45:55
just pussies out and loses, you know, very quickly.
00:45:58
It's got to be a big bad. And I think every one of those
00:46:01
components of what makes a race of Vince Flynn style race to the
00:46:05
finish, I think all of those components were here in the
00:46:08
final few chapters of this book. So I was very satisfied.
00:46:12
This is like, it reminded me of like finishing a Memorial Day or
00:46:16
the ending to an American assassin or I just had that
00:46:19
thrill of, you know, when a book peaks, there's nothing better
00:46:25
when you're at the point of a book, even if you haven't been
00:46:27
into the book, but but you're just hanging along, you're there
00:46:30
for the ride. And you're at that point of
00:46:32
like, is this book just becoming, you know, a burden for
00:46:34
me to have to finish just because?
00:46:36
Because I want to. And and it gets you, though,
00:46:39
when it grips you in that moment and doesn't let you put it down,
00:46:42
there's nothing like it. Like that is just such a fun
00:46:45
ride. It's a good feeling.
00:46:45
They accomplished that. They really did.
00:46:48
Yeah. No, it's good.
00:46:51
All right, so next time we'll be covering Dark Rising.
00:46:54
Should we do it? Should we just knock it out?
00:46:56
Let's do it, man. I've already started on Audible
00:46:59
so we're good to go. Let's go, let's go.
00:47:02
All right, I'm intrigued. I think, like, you know, the
00:47:05
ending and the culmination of the trilogy did definitely did
00:47:09
enough for me to want to read the next one because I'm I need
00:47:13
to know, know where we go next. Yeah, completely.
00:47:19
All right, Well. Before we get out of here, we
00:47:21
need to thank our patrons, our deputy director Sherry F, our
00:47:24
special operator, Jason C, our special agent Ben, Darrell,
00:47:27
Kevin, George, Matt, Dawn, Peggy, Chris and Mark.
00:47:31
Please subscribe to No Limits the Thriller Podcast.
00:47:35
You can find us.online@thrillerpod.com or on
00:47:37
Twitter, Instagram at Thriller podcast.
00:47:40
And as always, just let Eli Eli. What should have done just like
00:47:51
Corbin be Corbin could have done just like Corbin be Corbin.
00:48:00
Just let Sarah Beth be Sarah Beth.
00:48:05
What did you I guess we're we're just recording.
00:48:08
What did you think of Sarah Beth in the end when you really talk
00:48:11
about her? You know what?
00:48:14
She does shine in that final sequence.
00:48:16
She really does. To me, I thought she was a
00:48:19
little annoying like her mom in the first two books, but this
00:48:23
one, you know, I thought, you're right.
00:48:26
She she does shine and ultimately she is the reason
00:48:28
that, you know, they're able to to conquer and defeat Victor.
00:48:32
And so I think she she earned the right to be like a key
00:48:37
figure in the story, so. I think she did earn it.
00:48:40
I think she grew into the role and if it weren't for an age
00:48:44
gap, this is finally the point where I'm like, she could, she
00:48:47
could be a Corbin. She could pick up the mantle
00:48:48
where I don't know if I would have said that last book.
00:48:50
I don't think she was ready. This one, now that she's
00:48:52
projecting, she's able to project while running, which was
00:48:55
in That was an insane sequence, She.
00:48:59
Still has this kid like naivete of like, whoa, that's cool, I
00:49:01
didn't know I could do that. But you know, Corbin, I think
00:49:06
can show her. Wonder what's next for Corbin.
00:49:10
I know what's next for Sarah Beth.
00:49:11
She has to be the lead watcher. She has to teach the younger
00:49:13
kids. She has to perfect her powers.
00:49:15
She probably even has to go beyond a Pastor D You know, she
00:49:18
has to maybe she has to find like a Yoda.
00:49:22
You know, I feel like she has to find a Yoda and it it's possibly
00:49:26
Ben Morvent. I don't.
00:49:26
Know, I was just about to say that maybe it's Ben.
00:49:29
Maybe it's Ben, or Ben maybe has to realize she's so powerful
00:49:32
that he has to help her find a Yoda.
00:49:35
You know, I think it'd be really cool to do a Dagobah type scene
00:49:39
for her. She's either lost, she's gone,
00:49:42
or she willingly goes on a mission off grid and the fruits
00:49:47
that that mission will bear, Like Luke Skywalker doesn't get
00:49:51
it at first. He messes up, he has to go save
00:49:53
his friends. But ultimately he was destined
00:49:55
and designed to make those choices.
00:49:58
I think you could very much do a Sarah Beth Skywalker attempt.