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00:00:16
Well the kill so the theme we've had this whole time.
00:00:18
We've had, it's time to go hunting, that's come up a bunch
00:00:22
and we've got it's not paranoia. If someone's really after you
00:00:25
yet, line is used and recycled a bunch of times.
00:00:29
That's Jonathan. Line apparently, but but he
00:00:31
tells it to Katie. Katie repeats it.
00:00:33
Yeah. It's not paranoia paranoia.
00:00:35
If they're actually hunting you. Yep.
00:00:38
And Rafe says it at the very end here in the surf after he's,
00:00:43
he's taken out. So we're getting to the kill.
00:00:46
It's time to hunt. I feel like this is where the
00:00:48
book really gets back to the theme.
00:00:52
And Jack's talked about a bunch how he writes on that sticky
00:00:54
note, what the theme is to carry through the book.
00:00:58
And these last few chapters is Just 200 Pages, whatever 150
00:01:02
Pages, we are really getting into the dark side of man,
00:01:07
explored through the dynamic of the Hunter and the hunted.
00:01:10
I think you cannot put a better one line slogan on everything
00:01:16
that's about to happen. Besides the Dark Side of man,
00:01:19
explored through the dynamic of the Hunter and Hunted.
00:01:22
It's a perfect lens in which to read this here, right?
00:01:24
For sure, for sure. So at this point, they basically
00:01:29
can't Officially go. But you know of course being
00:01:32
that this is a jack car novel. He's going to get some sort of
00:01:34
band back together and I really like the descriptions of
00:01:37
everyone it does take a little bit of time.
00:01:39
I'm sure some like, more, casual readers, didn't really care for
00:01:44
the lineup of guys, but are you? Yeah, which I like all those
00:01:49
descriptions I think it's want to say Diaz, maybe is described
00:01:55
as the guy who makes half face blades, which in real life is
00:01:57
Andrea or be do, and he makes it Hunter Skinner which is a real
00:02:01
knife model that Andrea rabito makes he's a former seal friends
00:02:04
with Jack car. So it's like people he made the
00:02:08
details and descriptions of these people.
00:02:10
But his real buddies just were different different names.
00:02:14
And so, it's cool. It's like, it's like, if Jack is
00:02:17
writing James as himself, it's like, he's going on this op for
00:02:20
Revenge with his, with his buddies, which is kind of cool.
00:02:22
But it also gives like shoutouts to people who are doing
00:02:26
different things outside the military now.
00:02:27
So like if you're really into it, There's other things to
00:02:30
explore there as well. And I really like how just like
00:02:34
that bringing the cast of characters together.
00:02:36
Almost everybody Reese encounters because he's kind of
00:02:39
just that CIA spook in a lot of these meetings.
00:02:41
Yeah. Who is it, who is on the special
00:02:43
activities? You know end of things but
00:02:45
what's really cool is everyone's like I know who you are.
00:02:48
You know, thank you for what you've done, you know and all
00:02:51
this. And it's that one character I
00:02:52
think you're right Diaz or whoever who's in the unit that
00:02:55
Ranger unit that was training for the op initially.
00:02:58
Yeah, who you really like who actually Him, you know,
00:03:00
requisition the equipment, weapon 1049, whatever uniform
00:03:05
was he gets in for the CIA. I feel like just those little
00:03:08
interactions of, like, people coming up to Reese.
00:03:10
I think they're eating a meal when these first on site and
00:03:13
just what people say to him. You know, it's just is really
00:03:16
cool and I think that's where Jack is channeling.
00:03:19
What? He went through and the
00:03:21
closeness that he knew with his guys and other people in other
00:03:24
units and the, you really get the sense.
00:03:26
This is how operators talk to one another.
00:03:28
Yeah, like Chris said, Earlier this world feels so lived in and
00:03:33
it that's what kind of makes it believable when it's almost like
00:03:35
as much as he name drops, breath or novels in every single book
00:03:40
it's almost like someone's reading a breadth or novel.
00:03:42
That's just like an airport novel thriller book.
00:03:45
This is, this is reality. And it kind of, even though it's
00:03:50
like a name drop to a but, you know, and now friend of his,
00:03:53
it's at the same time, I don't know, it's like watching
00:03:58
something that's maybe a little bit more believable.
00:03:59
All at the same time because someone someone has something
00:04:02
that's fiction over there that we know is fiction, right?
00:04:07
One other angle as we're flushing out new characters.
00:04:10
And while I don't want to say the loser of the book for me,
00:04:14
something I think that takes it down a peg.
00:04:18
Is that you're almost at like the two-third three-quarter.
00:04:21
Mark squeezing too much in He's doing that.
00:04:26
With is the Reginal Pine story. We hear a little bit about
00:04:30
President Grimes, who was VP his chief of staff?
00:04:32
Is this jackass who wants to be the gatekeeper.
00:04:35
You know, he's this lobbyist was a basically destroyed people's
00:04:39
lives with the vaping and tobacco industries.
00:04:41
Use that to his Advantage pretending.
00:04:44
He's president making it seem like he could green-light.
00:04:46
The op are not by what he's going to pass on and allow
00:04:49
access to the president and I just so it was very flynny.
00:04:55
We Got a huge, huge back story on Reginald Pine and he was very
00:05:01
Vince Flynn. He's like a stew Garrett, you
00:05:03
know you want to hate him but I have enough people to hate at
00:05:06
this point and while I love the political angle in my books and
00:05:11
he could have been an awesome character.
00:05:13
I don't know if this is the right time to throw him in,
00:05:15
especially throw him in with that level of depth.
00:05:19
Yeah, I think if you compared to when we got another new
00:05:21
character in terms of the senator, right?
00:05:25
Senator Rapes. Father-in-law, we get the same
00:05:30
sort of back story with him, but I'm, I'm not minded by that, or
00:05:35
I'm not bothered, but like it actually adds to the story
00:05:38
because then we're with him, in a couple scenes, he becomes an
00:05:42
important like James uses airplane and he helps his cabin.
00:05:48
Yeah. Helps him use his cabin.
00:05:49
He helps them in the in the fight right there.
00:05:52
They're taking guns with Jonathan and, you know, Whereas
00:05:55
here, what I'm listening to that chapter, I thought like my, my
00:06:00
audible had like skipped or my scribed it skip I thought I'd
00:06:05
missed a couple chapters because it was just such a stark change
00:06:08
to our we're now because that I looked at was like, oh, there's
00:06:13
two only like two and a half hours left, right?
00:06:14
Or two hours. It's like working this new
00:06:16
character, and it's pretty in-depth and he's, is he
00:06:19
supposed to be his major player. He's an asshole that whole like
00:06:23
vaping thing. Like, It was just insane
00:06:27
backstory. Like just I think there's just
00:06:28
too much. I think if you just hold it, I
00:06:30
think if you just tone it down a little bit and not just made
00:06:34
him, all right? This is this guy and he's going
00:06:37
to say no, like, you know, I don't know, I wouldn't
00:06:41
understand to play my bigger problem, it is out of place, but
00:06:44
I think the wrong that is made, with this dickhead, is righted,
00:06:48
in the devil's hand, with the bet with the bad guy cast in
00:06:50
that in that book. So I agree, this guy is out of
00:06:53
place as far as back to Thorn, which I don't like his name
00:06:57
because it's so familiar with horn from the first novel.
00:07:00
Alright, I think Thorn, I like his background and how much it's
00:07:04
discussed because he has a conversation with Reese.
00:07:06
That's very important where he explains that he lost his wife
00:07:10
and hasn't been in the house since and and the gist of the
00:07:13
talk is they took your past from you, don't let them take your
00:07:16
future. So I think that is the main
00:07:19
purpose of that character in general.
00:07:21
Like and that's that conversation is important.
00:07:23
Yes, like it. It adds those Yes, so I don't
00:07:25
mind it. I learn about that.
00:07:27
Guy's background at all. This guy, he ultimately right.
00:07:31
In the end, we find out that he was being like used, right?
00:07:36
As a Russian mole, correct and little weak.
00:07:41
And at the end that guy like that said, a room happened
00:07:44
earlier. Yeah.
00:07:45
That LaRue character. Or if you had if you had
00:07:49
introduced him earlier and he had didn't, you know, he had
00:07:52
been LaRue had been talking to Gray and And you know, right
00:07:56
there had been this connection between the three different
00:07:59
stories. That's how Flynn would have done
00:08:01
it. Sure.
00:08:02
But I would hear it was just, it was just, it was really weird.
00:08:05
And why did you catch up on the line?
00:08:07
Why is he just going to go sell these secrets and tell them and
00:08:10
Spill the Beans to some random? Dude, it was just forced because
00:08:14
you needed it to leak out. Somehow I agree on this is this
00:08:16
is maybe one of my beefs with with how Jack does things but I
00:08:19
kind of like it at the same time.
00:08:20
It's like, you know, I talked to you guys before about how he
00:08:23
puts out those little two-minute trailers for the book.
00:08:25
That are filmed professionally and stuff.
00:08:27
So I have a description up of on, on his website of the book.
00:08:31
Now there's two little paragraphs in here.
00:08:33
That's a with an unknown entity inside the US, government
00:08:36
compromised by Russian intelligence Reese's forced to
00:08:39
recruit a team of former Commandos to bring his unique
00:08:42
brand of Vengeance, to the Russian mafia on their home
00:08:45
turf, turning the hunters into the hunted.
00:08:47
So if you don't read that, you aren't expecting this dipshit
00:08:52
that. You now get dumped about at.
00:08:55
Full chapter and a half of his background on, right.
00:08:57
So like what while I love these descriptions and I'm sure like
00:09:01
the one in the back of the book is the same or similar.
00:09:04
I feel like that information needs to be earlier.
00:09:07
That there is a mole in the US government.
00:09:09
We don't know who it is. It's I feel like sometimes maybe
00:09:13
those back of the cover things or the blurbs.
00:09:19
Because I felt like this with the latest comic book Legion is
00:09:25
the one of the main antagonists in that story and Legion is in
00:09:30
the the blur. But Legion doesn't come into the
00:09:33
Siri to the actual story until what 2/3 into the novel, Mike
00:09:37
Wright, and really do much. Does it really do much?
00:09:40
We we actually had recorded that episode that the book in into
00:09:45
separate chunks and purposely didn't read what we didn't.
00:09:49
We're talking about and as I then read the the description
00:09:53
Mike's like wait, we didn't even get to talk about Legion, then.
00:09:55
We haven't even read about Legion yet.
00:09:57
So I'm wondering, if maybe, maybe there is something else.
00:10:01
Maybe this book was longer, you know, how long was this book,
00:10:05
like, or time you can do? Don't I don't off the top of my
00:10:09
page was it seems longer than the last two.
00:10:13
Yeah, I think it might be the longest of this of the series
00:10:16
actually death death. So it doesn't feel like, it
00:10:20
doesn't feel like Jack is under this pressure.
00:10:24
That Kyle and Brad seem to be placed under by the Publishers.
00:10:29
I mean, or maybe I'm just like putting that on them, but I feel
00:10:35
like they are being forced to cut their books down.
00:10:40
Make them a little bit more quippy, little more quick reads.
00:10:43
It's where's Jack? It is going to shit.
00:10:46
This is 432 Pages for 32. Yeah.
00:10:51
And I do believe that it's the longest of the series, its
00:10:53
longest, it didn't feel that way except Parts, like this almost
00:10:59
made, it feel that way at times. But overall the pacing is so
00:11:02
good through the rest of it, right?
00:11:04
So when something like this storyline takes you out for a
00:11:06
little bit, you're kind of like wait what the valley scene was
00:11:10
awesome. And we're about to get to the
00:11:12
hunting scenes which are all And this I don't don't know why the
00:11:16
original Pine backstory, was so long ago.
00:11:18
Chris one other thing you made me think of is sometimes those
00:11:22
descriptions are written. So early, because the marketing
00:11:25
teams in the Publishers need something, they need that hook.
00:11:29
They need the synopsis. And I know Kyle is talked about
00:11:32
this and others. It's like Legion lead all of the
00:11:36
marketing. It was all about this Legion
00:11:38
villain that's out there. But then when the book I'd
00:11:41
written, it wasn't from Center. So I don't know if it's like
00:11:44
pacing and editing versus you need to write a synopsis and the
00:11:48
marketing pitch early and your final product might deviate a
00:11:51
little bit and so maybe that was stuff that got cut or this whole
00:11:55
there's a mole in the government.
00:11:56
He's like I'm going to push that off to the devil's hand.
00:11:58
Kind of stuff later on. Not necessarily going to lean
00:12:01
into it, too. Heavy and Savage sun because the
00:12:03
other stuff is gold. Right.
00:12:08
But now we're going to get into my favorite part of the book,
00:12:10
your favorite? Okay.
00:12:11
Take us to Siberia up. Well, I guess Kamchatka and many
00:12:14
Island wouldn't technically be Siberia.
00:12:16
It's a little little further east and south, but I die.
00:12:20
I meant to look this up. We're actually is Mandi island.
00:12:23
Is it a real place? I was surprised many island is
00:12:26
one of the closest Russian territories to the US with the
00:12:30
Aleutian Islands, ah, to island is one of the Alaskan Islands at
00:12:34
the end of the In chain and many island is not that far off.
00:12:38
So it's technically one of the most remote Russian islands and
00:12:45
one of the closest to the US Yeah, I'm looking at a map of it
00:12:50
right now. Okay.
00:12:52
I like that. I like that, it's not fictional,
00:12:54
no. And they even talked about going
00:12:56
to ah, to I think that's where if they needed, to get somebody
00:12:59
to the hospital, like Rafe which they needed to do their plan was
00:13:02
to stop there. Yeah.
00:13:03
Because that would be the closest medical facilities on
00:13:06
u.s. territory and it's not far off.
00:13:11
Yeah. So by this point the Commandos
00:13:14
are all prepped up and ready to go and we're on Thorns plane
00:13:18
with Liz, making hilarious in-flight comments which this
00:13:24
book does have a decent amount of comedy and I like I find
00:13:27
myself. Yeah I like juggling a couple
00:13:29
times and I think that's something that that each of
00:13:31
these books really needs while even if it's like I don't know
00:13:36
that. I feel like there's even a
00:13:36
couple points in like especially terminal list where like there's
00:13:39
comedy but it probably shouldn't be funny.
00:13:41
Russia. The situation in the reaction of
00:13:44
the characters is like Reese's such a smartass and people are
00:13:47
obviously dying horribly, but it made me laugh.
00:13:50
But this one does have some comedy in it so they're getting
00:13:53
ready to jump out of a cake like a private plane basically.
00:13:58
So yeah and they're going to do the hey ho jump and I kind of
00:14:02
enjoyed the storyline of the landing kind of going wrong and
00:14:07
having to adapt on the op because of the EMP basically.
00:14:11
Reginald Pine tipping off LaRue. Let the the Russians know
00:14:17
they're going to have a team inbound and so they were
00:14:19
prepared to take out their equipment which would lose their
00:14:22
advantage, you know, you know, you got nvgs.
00:14:26
They've got all the altimeters and different equipment for
00:14:28
their jump, different communication, comms and so
00:14:32
everything basically goes down and we get a pretty hard Landing
00:14:36
in the snow. And you got to fight in the
00:14:38
nighttime which allows and this is a The scene with the flares
00:14:44
and I love how Reese thinks back to Vietnam and its father, you
00:14:47
know, we turn the night into day, we send up these flares,
00:14:50
one by one, Reese goes up on a perch.
00:14:52
Get the drop on the guys and basically this Advanced team
00:14:55
sent to kill them, they're able to turn things around and get
00:14:59
the upper hand. And so now it can be Reese.
00:15:02
Going after. What's his name?
00:15:05
Alexander all on his own. Chris is there anything here you
00:15:09
really enjoyed for the jump and landing in first first assault?
00:15:13
Well, I think like just the fact they're doing good.
00:15:15
A try to perform a haho jump out of a G-Class like, you know,
00:15:21
private jet. Yeah, it's pretty insane.
00:15:23
You know, it's like some Mission Impossible, shit with the dog
00:15:26
with the doggy do. Yes.
00:15:28
Yeah, I like to, you know, again, this this community of
00:15:33
the good guys are going to get a pretty high score on my squad
00:15:37
car. And you know, just the group,
00:15:39
he's able to assemble and you know, when they're going through
00:15:42
the training and the people in the special ops community and
00:15:45
how they're going to help him out and how, you know, what it
00:15:51
Jonathan offers to pay all the guys like a quarter of a million
00:15:54
dollars in the one guy turns down and says put it in pretty
00:15:57
strains, kids fund or whatever. You know, all those little
00:16:01
details really like add Elevate this, the story and, you know,
00:16:06
there's things that give like we've said, I've got you placed
00:16:08
and that that have no meaning but I think there's some things
00:16:13
here that make it better and elevate it and I think you know
00:16:18
once we I like how the EMP is sort of juxtaposing this idea
00:16:25
of, you know, Rafe in the beginning, he's like of you guys
00:16:29
mentioned, he's the opposite of Jack and he sort of this
00:16:32
old-school guy. And so by taking away and going
00:16:36
back to basics that you really see how adaptive James can be
00:16:41
and how, you know, you believe. Now, that story that he was able
00:16:45
to, I think he even believed it more once he is able to track 6
00:16:48
months through Siberia but you believe that story of him like,
00:16:51
you know, carrying a kayak through Alaska and I love, you
00:16:57
know, he's on the stack up in a couple of the novel so far where
00:17:00
he talks to himself, he's like, think act, you know, like you
00:17:03
make a decision like I like when when I'm Jack puts those things
00:17:10
into James's head in and We're beginning to see this
00:17:15
relationship. His remembrance to his father
00:17:17
that's going to be like paint play.
00:17:18
A major role especially in in the blood and I liked all those
00:17:23
callbacks especially like towards the end here and I don't
00:17:27
know where we're going to get to this part.
00:17:28
Put the fucking. What did you guys think of
00:17:31
Alexander as a bad guy? We've already had him what we've
00:17:36
met him a couple different times.
00:17:37
You've had a couple of like we've obviously had his back
00:17:39
story, all the way back to when he was a kid watching his mom.
00:17:43
What off off herself? Yeah, when the Moose?
00:17:47
Yeah. Yeah, with the Moose seed,
00:17:49
wanted to watch the Moose suffer and his daddy and he got it's
00:17:52
from ad. When he put his dad killed, the
00:17:54
Moose this scene of his training in the SDR like that.
00:17:59
That was fun. That was really weird.
00:18:03
What did you guys? Think of him.
00:18:04
How does he stack up as as a big bad?
00:18:07
I think his mentality and everything.
00:18:10
Like he I think he's very intimidating on what he's
00:18:13
capable of and he views himself, very highly.
00:18:19
But I really think he's flushed out to be exactly what he really
00:18:22
is in the end right before his death, which is, which is a
00:18:26
killer, and a coward. And I mean, when it, when it
00:18:31
comes to this, you notice that Reese uses a And though, Rafe
00:18:35
uses a traditional bow, what does Alexander use?
00:18:39
He's has a crossbow. He uses he may quote hunt but
00:18:44
what he's doing compared to what how Rafe and James know how to
00:18:48
track is. He's a novice, he's a shortcut,
00:18:51
he's a wannabe but I hate it comes down.
00:18:53
To is like the best one-word description for Alexander is
00:18:55
that he is a wannabe and I think he really gets shown up and
00:19:01
while he's holding all the cards it's like somebody walked in.
00:19:04
He took his whole hand out of his head, like all the cards out
00:19:07
of his hand and holy. Forgot about his backstory.
00:19:10
Yeah, definitely adds to him as a character.
00:19:12
Yeah, I forgot about his training and that girl he
00:19:15
strangled and choking I went too far.
00:19:17
Yeah one thing we did skip over, I wanted to comment on his like
00:19:19
Oliver gray and that secretary and how she worked for Alexander
00:19:23
and kind of got the Ambush and place a little bit.
00:19:27
And then I really enjoyed, I thought it was very Espionage in
00:19:31
spy like how Oliver was at the Do and you could see a
00:19:35
silhouette and I think he lit a pipe.
00:19:37
And you can see like his face in the reflection, and she's out
00:19:39
there and she gets stabbed and he got off on it or ya self
00:19:43
over. Yeah, basically, I thought I
00:19:45
don't know why that's seen just the way.
00:19:47
It's written felt very like Noir.
00:19:51
Yeah, most Noir yeah, yeah, definitely got those vibes.
00:19:54
Like, I would view that in like black and white and it all agree
00:19:57
with you. Yeah, that one really stands
00:19:59
out. And again, it's Jack doing this.
00:20:00
Different genre are bringing in these different influences.
00:20:03
That's almost Very likely kharece.
00:20:05
Yeah. Or like Saboteur?
00:20:07
Yeah, exactly. Yeah.
00:20:08
Which we don't see a lot know in the rest of the cemeteries.
00:20:11
I don't know why that that stood out to me and I forgot to bring
00:20:14
it up earlier but anyways it's get back to Med knee so that the
00:20:19
EMP is something I'm not a huge fan of but it does force us to
00:20:23
where we want to be which is out of kind of your element and you
00:20:26
have to adapt and you don't have the technology that you usually
00:20:29
rely on because you're so used to James saying you take every
00:20:32
tactical and Tactical advantage in every situation.
00:20:36
You don't like square up evenly. You take as much of an advantage
00:20:39
as you can get. He doesn't have that here.
00:20:41
The exact team is kind of straight up screwed.
00:20:44
Yeah, I mean it's at the point he's got to fight off a dog with
00:20:47
a snowshoe. Like yeah yeah.
00:20:49
So well he's already coming in. Like what he said normally he
00:20:54
would had 40 guys and if you are a team like yeah quick reaction
00:20:58
towards unchill. He's going in with five guys at
00:21:01
a dog and flares. Employers, like, you know, in
00:21:05
each issue of them has two flares.
00:21:07
That's it. So, yeah, I love the problem
00:21:08
solving in, in this part. Yes, I am trying to recall.
00:21:14
They use the flare and do that system.
00:21:16
And I think Farkas gets injured, right?
00:21:19
And then they make it. And then they end up making it
00:21:21
to the, to this, to the area where people are held, right in
00:21:24
the jail cells and stuff. Yep.
00:21:25
Right. Then they go through the house
00:21:27
exactly goes through the house. He finds Hannah's head you know?
00:21:30
Yeah in formaldehyde and the a jar.
00:21:32
Yeah. Which is obviously super Ruff,
00:21:35
there's two moments in this book that feel they don't feel out of
00:21:40
place, but they feel like Hollywood moments in there.
00:21:43
Just sentences, just just a couple sentences.
00:21:45
And one of them is that he convinces the group that he
00:21:50
needs to go finish this alone, which seems corny at first, but
00:21:54
then, the following couple sentences is him justifying it,
00:21:57
which is two guys have to carry Farkas one, hold security.
00:21:59
I'm like, okay, I'm in you just sold me on this idea that I just
00:22:02
a second ago. I wasn't On board with you, have
00:22:06
you just left it with like, I got to do this alone and he
00:22:09
walks away. Yeah, yeah.
00:22:11
Bunch of bullshit. The justification of it makes me
00:22:13
100% like even more, okay with it.
00:22:16
I agree. Definitely agree.
00:22:18
And they can't miss the extract. And if yes, they try to go do
00:22:20
the mission then pull Farkas out.
00:22:22
You're going to miss it. You're stuck in Siberia, 100%,
00:22:26
And the Russians are going to be bearing down on you.
00:22:28
So, from that point, I think they felt if really focuses more
00:22:31
on Alexander versus Rafe, and I can't recall, Who Alexander's
00:22:36
native buddy is Sergey. That's that big Kodiak dude.
00:22:41
Yeah, which the fight instead of a man, the fight between him and
00:22:44
James is might be my Beth, my favorite one on one fight in the
00:22:47
series. I think I agree.
00:22:49
I think I agree. He's looking at different like
00:22:52
fighting styles. He recognizes like, Samba one
00:22:54
point. Yeah, something else.
00:22:55
He's always doing this move and yeah for me the best part.
00:22:59
Is he saw him? He Sergei, let's James get his
00:23:04
Snowshoe off and he's approaching him and he said he
00:23:06
caught a spinning back kick from him and he goes a spinning back
00:23:10
kick from a man that size with that much force.
00:23:13
I am in trouble and I feel like that line is like the setup for
00:23:17
like he's outmatched. He needs to figure something out
00:23:20
and luckily he has the Old Faithful Winkler on him.
00:23:25
The ends up giving him the upper hand.
00:23:27
Dude, he does some work with that Winkler there.
00:23:29
Yeah, I mean, whenever we talk about the Dark Side of, man,
00:23:32
it's not only Alexander, It's also res getting absolutely
00:23:36
Savage. And really when we talk about
00:23:39
ancient weapons, it just turns and turns them into exactly that
00:23:43
just a Savage. He runs the Crux of the Winkler
00:23:47
like down the guy's arm to disarm him.
00:23:49
Yeah, and yeah, I mean there's so many Winkler moments, that's
00:23:53
one of the more subtle ones with James Reese.
00:23:55
It's not like, you know, the e- around on the head or whatever.
00:23:59
Yeah, this is a much more subtle one.
00:24:01
That's embedded in a bigger fight and it is just Awesome.
00:24:05
It's one of those things I heard this at one of the Thriller
00:24:08
conferences, you write your slow scenes, fast and you're fast
00:24:11
seen slow. I am so glad that that fight
00:24:14
took a couple of pages because it's probably a really quick
00:24:16
fight in a actual timeline. Yeah.
00:24:19
But Jack chose to deliberately take you through the mind of a
00:24:22
warrior and how time slows and how you are really being
00:24:27
intentional about how you're going to win the fight and he
00:24:30
does that a bunch of times when they're doing the flare thing,
00:24:32
it's so rushed. They're getting shot out.
00:24:35
How do they get out of this? Even Rafe pinned down in the
00:24:37
valley yet. Jack is able to slow those
00:24:40
scenes down and take us through every sense that an operator has
00:24:45
every sense. Every decision they're making,
00:24:48
and how they're going to communicate it to the team.
00:24:50
And I just love the writing of Jack doing either a hand-to-hand
00:24:56
fight scene or a full-on Ambush scene is just way different than
00:25:00
any other person with either limited or no military
00:25:04
experience trying to do it. I'm not saying one is better
00:25:06
worse. Ones a better author, but it's
00:25:08
just so different and you could tell it's another level here.
00:25:15
Yeah, hundred hundred percent. I like that fight scene.
00:25:18
Probably the, that's probably my favorite part about this whole
00:25:20
third Act of the kill. I was really hoping.
00:25:26
So at this point at this point what I was hoping for was Rafe
00:25:30
and Alexander to get separated and James to be the Alexander's
00:25:35
Focus for a little bit and and then the hunt really Beyond.
00:25:38
And you can I was I was hoping for like a Viewpoint where
00:25:41
Alexander thinks he knows what he's doing and then like a
00:25:44
master show. Shows him what one's really up.
00:25:47
And while, I don't know, sometimes I make my expectations
00:25:50
to too strong, it ends up being pretty pretty well done.
00:25:56
Still just being in this moment and knowing this is based off of
00:25:59
the most dangerous game. I thought that there would be a
00:26:02
little bit more of a one-on-one thing, but at the same time I
00:26:05
feel like that would feel to Hollywood as well.
00:26:07
So I'm happy they didn't go that route and I was nervous.
00:26:10
I was similarly nervous about the most dangerous game.
00:26:14
That somebody was just going to show up in a bedroom and be
00:26:16
hiding behind the curtains or whatever.
00:26:17
Yeah, hop out and get Alexander in the middle of the night.
00:26:19
I was like it really worked in the most dangerous game.
00:26:22
It was freaking brilliant. He even says that he Alexander
00:26:27
is thinking, he going to go back to my my room and wait for me to
00:26:31
go into. Go to sleep.
00:26:32
Like even love that as that. Yeah, love that line.
00:26:35
Yeah. That line got me because I was
00:26:36
like, oh that that was it. That's what stuff is such a
00:26:39
callback. And he told me that he's not
00:26:42
going to do that. That Jack's not just going.
00:26:43
To have that have yet to take the easy way out.
00:26:45
Yes, really. So at this point, we don't
00:26:48
realize it but what James has done, I believe is picked up
00:26:51
sergei's bow. That he was training with
00:26:55
earlier in, in the book and this really turns into a focus of
00:26:59
Alexander versus Rafe. Rafe gets very injured, very
00:27:04
fast, but he does put up a fight.
00:27:06
It's not the same as Hannah while he you think he's going to
00:27:10
do the same thing as Hannah. It drastically takes a left
00:27:13
turn. When he throws a rock.
00:27:17
Football sized Rock, I think. Yeah.
00:27:19
And there's another most dangerous game reference with
00:27:21
Rafe backtracking and covering his tracks, making them go one
00:27:25
way where he's really going to backtrack through them and then
00:27:28
covers tracks going somewhere else.
00:27:31
And then how Alexander is thinking well like every trained
00:27:35
Warrior he's just going to go to The High Ground.
00:27:37
Take the highest ground. I'll know what he's going to do.
00:27:39
This is predictable but then Alexander goes, wait or does he
00:27:42
know that I'm going to know that he would do that.
00:27:45
And there's a lot of meta back and forth going on here and I
00:27:48
think it really adds to the suspense.
00:27:50
I agree. It does add the suspense.
00:27:52
Chris, would you think of this Rafe?
00:27:54
Alexander Showdown, the hunt, I liked it.
00:27:58
I wondered a little bit more like I could, I'm always wanting
00:28:02
more I could have done with a little bit more like focusing on
00:28:05
Rafe and and like and then also like the whole because all of
00:28:11
this is happening like I thought it was kind of crazy.
00:28:13
How Alexander and Rafe are on this hunt and he sort of just
00:28:19
left his goodies. He knows that James is coming
00:28:22
right to take care of these like he's so arrogant.
00:28:25
I guess that that plays into like like you said, he's a poser
00:28:29
he or he's inexperienced he's like oh you know forget about
00:28:34
this guy who has this had this turbo list and killed all these
00:28:38
people like my goes are going to get him.
00:28:41
I'm gonna go in this hug. I wanted a little bit I wanted
00:28:44
to focus more of my time on the hunt and like I said, it would
00:28:49
have been cool to get more of like this.
00:28:51
Trifecta of Reese, Rafe and Jonathan.
00:28:55
But I will say like the end where you know, sort of all
00:29:00
culminates. I thought it was perfect.
00:29:02
So in the end we got there and I was happy with how concluded but
00:29:06
you know, I could always do with more.
00:29:08
Yeah, a little bit like my you could have, you could have
00:29:11
gotten rid of that chapter. With, with vegetal pied and put,
00:29:15
it another chapter of laying back and forth, you know,
00:29:18
hunting. And, you know, you would have
00:29:21
got a couple more points out of me.
00:29:22
Yeah, hashtag. I'm all right.
00:29:25
I think the the, the complaint that I just had about James
00:29:29
versus Alexander, being like a thing, and like the Hunt is
00:29:32
really on. I think that I basically wanted
00:29:35
to see James has skills. Which in a way is corrected in
00:29:38
the epilogue. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:29:41
That's true. That, that to me.
00:29:43
Is the is the actual hunt. What Alexander is doing?
00:29:47
He's not a hunt like Rafe says he's not a hunter.
00:29:49
He's just the killer. The real hunk is James and
00:29:53
Oliver is, that's the hunt, right?
00:29:57
Yeah. We already kind of talked about
00:29:58
the epilogue but you know, I said, I was one of my favorite
00:30:01
Parts. I wanted to see that that
00:30:03
entire, you know, while I appreciate it.
00:30:06
Like, I totally grew and what did think about, how poetic and
00:30:11
Short story ask that epilogue is, I could have read an entire
00:30:16
book. That was that six pots, you
00:30:18
know, do you mind one more long quote just because it's that
00:30:22
good? Yeah, go ahead.
00:30:24
Yeah, it just, it's that good and I can't even do it justice.
00:30:28
If only we can use, right, Porter's.
00:30:29
Nice here. Yeah, we don't want to get sued
00:30:31
for all the pennies that we make off advertising.
00:30:33
So quote, as winter settled upon the harsh land, a rumor began to
00:30:39
swirl Among The Villages of the krasner yours.
00:30:41
Asik cry. A ghost was moving across the
00:30:44
tundra, sometimes taking the shape of the animals that
00:30:47
inhabited the Wilderness. Some of the stories described
00:30:50
him as half-man half-beast still.
00:30:53
Others were sure one of the brown bears that inhabited, the
00:30:56
interior had killed, a nomadic Hunter, merging their souls.
00:30:59
The stories were passed along in the way they had.
00:31:01
Since the first peoples had moved into this land, following
00:31:05
the herds that gave them sustenance.
00:31:06
The ghost would occasionally, steal food and supplies from The
00:31:10
Villages along his path. F, always a gift left an
00:31:13
exchange. No one knew his destination but
00:31:16
it was rumored. He was heading West toward what
00:31:18
or whom was unknown mother's maintained an attentive eye on
00:31:22
their children. Keeping them closer than usual
00:31:24
fathers and Hunters took an extra minute to pause and study
00:31:27
the landscape before closing their doors at night.
00:31:30
Once a village, heard a gunshot in the distance, even spectres
00:31:33
had to eat. Boom, that last line just its
00:31:39
haunting. It's just even absolutely Susan
00:31:41
tea. Yeah, love that.
00:31:47
So there's one other thing though.
00:31:48
Before we jump into the epilogue, what'd you think about
00:31:51
the team popping up and essentially saving him?
00:31:54
I thought it was pretty cool. That Vic was able to work his
00:31:57
magic. I forget if they say he got
00:31:59
through to the president or whatnot, but somehow, that seal
00:32:02
team was authorized to come in and extract the crew, and they
00:32:07
kind of just pop up out of nowhere.
00:32:09
Oh yeah. Almost like I love it.
00:32:11
The Lord of the Rings U equals. Yeah.
00:32:13
They swooping up Frodo and Sam they literally are I like that
00:32:18
they talk about being in sdv team which is Seal delivery
00:32:21
vehicle which is a very small submarine that carries a couple
00:32:26
of guys and it's a wet sub. So as far as I know you have to
00:32:29
have scuba gear inside and it's actually water inside and out
00:32:33
but you like ride in it. So those are real things and
00:32:38
they wouldn't like come up on radar and stuff for many Island.
00:32:41
I don't think they would arrive because they are so small.
00:32:44
So I thought that was pretty cool.
00:32:46
I like how they just Kind of come out of nowhere.
00:32:48
Jonathan and his rage showing up out of nowhere is is pretty
00:32:52
great and I like how he he hisses fuck you to them whenever
00:32:58
they ask for names, even though it's clearly an American.
00:33:03
So that's my second Hollywood moment is coming up, which is
00:33:08
Reese turning around and going to Siberia alone.
00:33:12
Oh yeah. That's that's total Hollywood
00:33:14
right there. Which like, it's funny.
00:33:18
Like every time I think is something that bothers me,
00:33:20
there's something that makes it, okay?
00:33:22
And like, the thing that I like, wouldn't happen if it weren't
00:33:25
for the Hollywood dish feeling moment, unfortunately.
00:33:28
But you have to have a few of them.
00:33:31
Yeah. You can sprinkle a few, in which
00:33:32
I can lean on it, too, heavily. I think there's two.
00:33:35
So that's perfect. And let's go down.
00:33:38
See ya. The justification of the 144
00:33:41
Farkas is awesome. Well, There's another line there
00:33:46
from Jonathan which I really liked where he was like.
00:33:51
I was not going to let the boys I can.
00:33:53
I'm already going home. One, child short.
00:33:56
I wasn't going to go home with a second one.
00:33:58
I would have no life after that. If I left, Rafe out here and I
00:34:00
knew, I didn't give everything including myself to go get him.
00:34:03
Yeah, but I knew all the other Lads, they can go home to their
00:34:06
families. Yeah, I'm not going home to a
00:34:08
complete family anymore. I might go home to almost, no
00:34:11
family, half a family. Yeah, yet they can go home.
00:34:13
So I'm sending him home and I'm going in.
00:34:15
I like, I like that little line two.
00:34:17
Yeah, I like Jonathan really gets flushed out as like a
00:34:20
Probably the most badass sub character in the series, through
00:34:25
his actions in this one. Nope, Caroline.
00:34:27
Hastings Carolina and Jonathan. How about that are a couple and
00:34:31
put them together? That's fine.
00:34:33
The Hastings and gentlemen. Yeah, just like name.
00:34:36
There's been talk and a lots of lots of questions about books.
00:34:40
Just on the Hastings in the future.
00:34:41
Oh yeah possibility. Absolutely.
00:34:46
So, you know, at this point, we didn't even talk about the the
00:34:50
kill which is Reese killing Alexander with, with sergei's
00:34:57
bow. I love the description of how
00:35:00
he's getting ready to kill Rafe and he says, he willed his hand
00:35:05
to pull the trigger and it just wouldn't.
00:35:06
And he looked down and saw a broad head sticking out of the
00:35:09
left of his chest. He just thought that it looked
00:35:12
familiar and nothing really clicked, and then a second one.
00:35:15
Came through his chest and then he fell and like, I don't know
00:35:18
why, I like the description. How it didn't quite a lot.
00:35:21
Hit Alexander that this was a possibility that he would lose.
00:35:26
That goes to Chris's point. That he kind of had his defenses
00:35:28
down, thinking, my guys are going to take care of reefs in
00:35:31
the insertion team. And I'm free to hunt, I don't
00:35:33
have a care in the world and that was his hubris, his
00:35:36
downfall. Yeah.
00:35:37
And even even recovering, Rafe is stressful where he goes in
00:35:40
there finds a body and it's Alexander, he's like, get the
00:35:42
hell away from me and he pushes him back in the water and keep
00:35:45
swimming it. Yeah, keeps finding Rafe.
00:35:48
So at that point it. So after that that team shows up
00:35:50
we talked about already. So if you guys want to we can
00:35:53
talk about the epilogue again. Let's do it.
00:35:56
Let's do it. Yeah, a lot going on the
00:35:57
epilogue in, we also have the shipping container to.
00:36:00
So yeah, talked about Reese going through Siberia anything
00:36:03
more there. Or can we get into the real
00:36:05
personal here? Reese, getting back home.
00:36:08
I mean, Chris, you got anything other than I like how he
00:36:11
negotiates how to get back to the States.
00:36:14
Yeah. No I think it's the whole scene
00:36:17
with you know, the father or the, what's the Russian Vani
00:36:23
Vani? John Jarvis, I do.
00:36:25
But what's what do they call Pagano mahad?
00:36:29
Oh yeah, I think it's all gone. Yeah, orally or something.
00:36:35
So that whole saying, like, like I said before, I was, I thought
00:36:38
he was going to let you know, Gray live and I was going to be
00:36:42
pissed, but he didn't. So it came through and I see
00:36:46
that. All right.
00:36:48
He really didn't have that much beef with Yvonne in terms of, I
00:36:53
guess, like, tell you were kind of saying that he might have
00:36:57
been The Mastermind behind the, the Ukraine plot just mainly
00:37:03
behind the all of her great. Ray stuff right in in True
00:37:07
Believer but I can see how, you know, Reese is becoming this,
00:37:12
you know, CIA, spook type thing, you know, finding an asset where
00:37:17
he can potentially use the future.
00:37:20
I mean, he basically says, I'm not going to like spy for you
00:37:23
but you know, we could work out a deal.
00:37:25
You know, if you need something, I need something type in.
00:37:28
It's good to have those kind of relationships going forward.
00:37:32
And I like how the rest of this prologue.
00:37:34
Do we get? We get set up for the next
00:37:37
couple books and we're going to really flush that out in the
00:37:41
blood, right? With his father.
00:37:43
And what we find this lock, is there like right this safety
00:37:48
deposit key? He gets the watch.
00:37:51
He gets the car. I love the gray and white layer.
00:37:54
You can see and visit shot and Ithaca shotgun?
00:37:56
Yes, you know, so I think it does what all good epilogues do
00:38:02
in terms of like giving us some finality.
00:38:06
Some, you know, ending to the story.
00:38:08
While also giving us enough, Intrigue, keep us waiting for
00:38:13
the next year or so. Whenever the next book comes
00:38:15
out, right? Yeah, this really isn't an in
00:38:17
the blood level of a cliffhanger but at the same time I got to
00:38:21
know what the safety deposit box key is for and which we still
00:38:26
don't know, he actually still don't know, but backlog in a
00:38:29
quick to the end of him and zharkov talking I loved the two
00:38:33
threats that were made. The if Kill me.
00:38:37
I have a friend that will not be as kind as I would be and then I
00:38:43
like that, you know, if you've I think he says, if you fuck me, I
00:38:47
will end your entire bloodline. All right.
00:38:49
I like everything about that conversation.
00:38:51
Yeah, yeah, that's fantastic. And to say that an American
00:38:55
wiped, the zhirkov, the bratva leader.
00:38:57
Yeah. Mob bosses, bloodline from from
00:39:00
history. Yeah.
00:39:02
That will be shame for your fam, like, shame for your name, for
00:39:05
for eternity. Yeah, I love everything about
00:39:08
that deal. You really like to do that
00:39:10
whole, that whole end dialogue after after the demise of
00:39:13
Oliver's is solid and it set up, I think, I think we, as a
00:39:17
readers are set to accept that when Yvonne really wants to
00:39:25
distance himself from his own son.
00:39:27
I think we realize while this is a bad guy, he's bad hombre.
00:39:32
We realize he's not the bad, in the sense of he must be
00:39:36
eliminated right away. Yeah, he's bad in the sense of
00:39:39
might be useful for a little while with his power and his
00:39:41
connections. And he's bad in almost a noble
00:39:45
way. Like a traditional way of.
00:39:46
Yeah. They at least have rules.
00:39:48
He's going to at least play by the rules.
00:39:50
The bad guy? Rules and we can work with that.
00:39:52
The CIA wants that right? The CIA doesn't want loose
00:39:55
cannons. Yeah.
00:39:56
Will turn on you. They want the traditionalist who
00:39:58
still play Within certain boundaries.
00:40:00
They'll fuck you but you know, the boundaries they'll play by.
00:40:02
Yeah, you really walk away. Thinking that Yvonne is not as
00:40:05
bad as Alexander. Right.
00:40:08
Oh absolutely. And definitely not as crazy.
00:40:10
I think that's that's the key difference.
00:40:13
Yeah, yeah. So I like the deal and he has a
00:40:16
line, you know, Reese basically makes up his mind.
00:40:19
He's going to go back work with the CIA and Vic told him, you'll
00:40:22
get the four years out of me. And now he's got a line and an
00:40:27
open line of communication with someone like that.
00:40:29
Can have a lot of benefits later down the road.
00:40:32
Even ones, you can expect right now for sure.
00:40:35
Yep, it's all opening these Doors to potential in the future
00:40:40
so he essentially turned them. Yeah, yeah I think zharkov
00:40:44
thinks he has Reese but has a recent Reese.
00:40:47
Reese has zharkov in the big ones that happen.
00:40:51
Exactly. Who's gonna look, man.
00:40:54
Good stuff right there. We did scorecard.
00:40:57
I think we've gotta give our final scores on the scorecard,
00:41:00
Tyler. I sent it to you in advance.
00:41:02
Do you have your 50 points ready to break down with us?
00:41:05
You know what you're going to do?
00:41:07
Yeah, I think so. Well, walk us through your
00:41:10
action and plot. Those are the heaviest on the
00:41:12
scorecard 10 points, each up for grabs action and plot what say
00:41:16
you? They're 10 apiece.
00:41:18
I mean this is my favorite fiction, novel ever, so coming
00:41:21
on strong ever. Okay, yeah, and I don't know.
00:41:25
I don't wanna mess. Yeah, I'm in the middle of term
00:41:28
limits. Okay, but I am not as well.
00:41:31
Read in the fiction side of things, as you guys, I read a
00:41:34
lot of nonfiction and a lot of other military books as well,
00:41:37
but but this is like Jack cars. My favorite author for fiction
00:41:41
stuff is my favorite series and this is my favorite book in that
00:41:44
Series. So there's not really there's
00:41:47
not really a whole lot. I mean the only category that I
00:41:51
can maybe doc it all is Is bad guys because of the will mole
00:41:56
get there? We'll get there when we get
00:41:58
there. So Mike, what did you have for
00:42:01
action of wobbling? I'm going to agree with Ty on
00:42:04
the action, there, when the action is happening, there is
00:42:07
nothing better than it when it's happening.
00:42:10
I say, because I went down to an eight on plot because while the
00:42:14
pacing is pretty good and the action is thrown in at the right
00:42:17
times. I bought into the plot more in
00:42:20
the first two, thirds of the Katie, the Hastings, the ranch,
00:42:25
then Katie drops off the face of the Earth, which I understand
00:42:28
why that needs to happen. And then the plot becomes more
00:42:31
heavy on this Reginald Pine guy. And once that shift happens, the
00:42:36
plots a little less intriguing. So, thankfully, the action
00:42:38
carries through till the very end 10/10, but because of the
00:42:42
plot and the intricacies of how its woven together, the last
00:42:48
half of The book maybe suffered a bit, so eight on plot 10 on
00:42:51
action. All right, I'm kind of along the
00:42:54
lines with you, Mike, but I didn't talk as much as you doc,
00:42:57
glad as an IDE, so they kind of get a good 19 points out of
00:42:59
planned action. That's, that's still pretty
00:43:01
good. But did this keep you guys
00:43:04
bought in the hallway? A perfect 5 means your your
00:43:07
bought in in the sense of the storytelling is gripping.
00:43:10
You the whole time but also by in in the realism the is yeah.
00:43:14
Did this feel real you? Oh totally.
00:43:17
This, like I said, I think we will.
00:43:19
All of us have said it, this book feels good.
00:43:23
I think the intangibles that Jack puts in it or not
00:43:26
intangible. But the actual the tangibles
00:43:27
that he puts in, in terms of lacing, the details just allow
00:43:33
you to believe that this could truly be a real story so I was
00:43:38
bought in five out of five die. Yep, I'm with Chris same
00:43:41
reasons. I hear a lot of like complaints
00:43:43
about his books from people who say stuff like you know, we
00:43:46
don't With the serial number is on the gun but like as a gun
00:43:49
Guru and stuff, he doesn't go into that much detail but it
00:43:52
like, it, it does. We've read, we've heard worse.
00:43:55
Yeah, got worse. But like, I know more, I guess
00:43:58
and like, everybody complains about how much detail he goes
00:44:02
into for the, for the gear, like, as a gear guy myself.
00:44:06
I really appreciate like that kind of detail.
00:44:08
And it's not too much like to where he describes what color it
00:44:11
is. Like, yep, it matters.
00:44:13
Why? No nothing.
00:44:14
I is carrying nothing about the equipment.
00:44:16
Went well, it's absolutely not enough there.
00:44:18
Where if you cared you could find out exactly what you're
00:44:21
imagining and if you don't care it's fine.
00:44:23
It doesn't limit your body and it doesn't hurt you out of the
00:44:26
story. If you don't care, you just kind
00:44:28
of read it and you're like, okay cool, I havenít visual now move.
00:44:31
Yeah, so you're at a 10, you understand it.
00:44:34
I'm at a zero yet, we can equally enjoy those parts of the
00:44:36
books. Yeah.
00:44:37
Well, correct me if I'm wrong, but I think this might be the
00:44:39
last one in the series where he had to put it through DOD
00:44:42
approval. So in the epilogue there, there
00:44:44
was a whole paragraph redacted. Right.
00:44:47
Yeah there was one chapter where there was like as I'm listening
00:44:51
to it every other word that Ray was saying and something like 59
00:44:55
Ray was just saying that your dad acted when they were talking
00:44:57
about like the the different mode of action that they could
00:45:00
go through. Yeah, with victim regas.
00:45:03
It was just redacted. Redacted, redacted for the end
00:45:06
of training when they did the money I'm saying is it raining?
00:45:08
Yeah. See I like that.
00:45:09
I know some people say takes him out of the story and they're
00:45:12
bothered by it. I love it.
00:45:14
I think it adds to the mystery. And perhaps my favorite part
00:45:18
about it is when Jack puts a little nod to his frustrations
00:45:22
with that and the author's note. And he says, if you're really
00:45:24
paying attention, you can read between the lines and I think, I
00:45:28
think if you read these books and you're not paying attention
00:45:31
to try to read between the lines, they're good.
00:45:33
If you are paying attention, they're great, they go beyond
00:45:36
good, they go to Great and the rib, the redactions, I think
00:45:39
they're fun. I think they mean it's real.
00:45:41
I think it shows the bullshit he went through and as a reader, I
00:45:44
just It gives me some incense of intrigue.
00:45:47
I like it. Agreed.
00:45:50
Bad guys, Good Guys, Tyler, why don't you break down both bad
00:45:53
guys and good guys, good guy. Well, okay, bad guys, first, I
00:45:57
think the cast is fantastic. Except for the mole, they key is
00:46:01
the weakest link of the entire novel.
00:46:04
So what's the point Max for both of these is that these are all
00:46:07
five. Yeah, I've gotten here on out so
00:46:09
five two halves you may do have. I'm gonna give bad guys for
00:46:15
because it just sucks like the rest of the cast.
00:46:17
The bad guys is great. All of her grave.
00:46:20
Just people that you love to dislike and you want to see meet
00:46:24
their demise has as they do the good guys.
00:46:28
There's such a big cast of good guys that they get five because
00:46:31
everyone's so well flushed out, they feel real.
00:46:34
They feel they feel like each of them could maybe have like their
00:46:38
own novel at some point like right, you know, they just feel
00:46:44
like they're very well, thought out very detailed.
00:46:48
And so good. Guys, get before five.
00:46:52
I think we have some consensus here because I also gave it a
00:46:55
four to five, you know, pretty much for the same reasons.
00:46:58
There was some, you know, while I think gray and Alexander were,
00:47:05
you know guys that were super despicable you know maybe just
00:47:12
argue that there was and then I guess you'd be throwing Yvonne
00:47:16
like there was just a lot of them and then there's also like
00:47:19
the mercenaries and then definitely that I forget his
00:47:23
name but the mole gyro original Pine and like how he's being
00:47:27
worked as a mole like that, that was just, you know, that's the
00:47:30
big thing that we're going to dig in here but the good guys
00:47:32
like you know, you bring back in you brought back in Katy you
00:47:38
Back in is this is Riley. You have all the Hastings.
00:47:42
You have all of the special ops guys that helped Reese out the
00:47:46
dogs. You know the good guys, they win
00:47:50
this level. Yeah, I'll agree with you all.
00:47:54
I was gonna go a little lower on bad guys, didn't go down to that
00:47:58
3 because the others deserve it. Alexander and his backstory just
00:48:02
being crazy. His Dynamics with his father,
00:48:06
Oliver gray. Gotta love to hate like you
00:48:07
said, Ed. So I didn't bang them too much
00:48:10
on the on the very few bad guys who are poorly written.
00:48:13
So I went with the for, although I disagree on good guys.
00:48:17
It's not just a 5, it's a 5 plus plus plus plus, plus plus we
00:48:21
give it a more that if I've this is a fantastic cast of
00:48:25
characters. Everyone you mentioned and you
00:48:27
could even one up that it just keeps going Vic Rodriguez and
00:48:31
the DCI, the director of Central Intelligence that lady in the
00:48:34
meeting. Just everyone on the good side
00:48:38
is awesome and they're not just purely awesome.
00:48:41
They're, they're complex and they're individuals.
00:48:44
So it's not just the same one story for all the good guys.
00:48:47
It's a complex network of relationships and it's all
00:48:51
grounded in history and reverence and respect for one
00:48:55
another everyone plays a role perfectly.
00:48:58
Love the good guys. Yeah.
00:48:59
Real quick, all of her gray Jeep reminds me of like grima
00:49:03
wormtongue from Lord of the Rings.
00:49:05
Let right? That level of bad guy.
00:49:07
Yeah. Yes, that is the Stuttgart
00:49:09
Arkansas. A slimeball.
00:49:11
You just want to know Seagate get murked 100% 100%.
00:49:16
Speaking of Lord of the Rings which has some really great
00:49:18
settings in New Zealand and all these sweeping shots.
00:49:21
What do you say for the setting here?
00:49:24
Tell me that perfect five now. Ya gotta be, yeah, hundred
00:49:26
percent between just between Siberia and Montana.
00:49:30
It's a five. And then you throw in mednick
00:49:32
which for some reason like a more times I read or listen to
00:49:35
this II. Don't know why that island is
00:49:38
like your is it? I mean kinda I just look at
00:49:41
pictures of it. I don't know how much flights
00:49:44
are but it just seems. It seems like it seems like a I
00:49:50
like it more than now that it's that it's not fiction, it just
00:49:53
seems like a place where people could get away with exactly what
00:49:57
we're reading about. Yeah, you know, you guys both
00:50:01
might like Connor Sullivan, his debut, debut novel was Sleeping
00:50:04
Bear, and it must must have drawn some inspiration here from
00:50:09
Savage sun, because very similar.
00:50:11
It's about hunting hunting humans.
00:50:13
Takes place in Alaska and across this northeastern part of
00:50:17
Siberia. So I really think you like that
00:50:20
one. It's very similar to us.
00:50:22
What was the title Sleeping Bear by Connor Sullivan?
00:50:26
He's got a second book coming out soon so but it's not related
00:50:30
right? Not related at all but I you can
00:50:31
definitely the way we've been talking you can sense there's
00:50:35
There's some inspiration here. It takes place in Alaska.
00:50:38
It's it's a hunt Centric, novel. How about the setting for you
00:50:42
guys? That's a five.
00:50:44
Like this is, you know, it I think the time we spend both in
00:50:49
Montana and then somebody area, you know, he executes it really
00:50:53
well. So it's got, I don't know which
00:50:55
one, I like more Montana or many islands tough, it's tough,
00:51:00
they're fantastic five, plus again, plus plus plus All right.
00:51:06
Should we do the covers first or should we give our free space?
00:51:09
Which Tyler? If you don't know you get a free
00:51:10
five points for whatever the winner was.
00:51:13
Whatever your favorite part of the book was kind of like this
00:51:15
last-minute shout out. So you want to do that first or
00:51:18
you want to do covers free space first and covers three space.
00:51:21
Yep. Alright so my five points is
00:51:23
going to the Reece versus Sergei fight by itself.
00:51:28
Is some of the best action I've read in a book.
00:51:32
You're just the way it's described as Is super well.
00:51:35
Well done and easy to understand and it feels like you're reading
00:51:41
and you reading faster and faster, because you're imagining
00:51:44
how quickly this combat is happening.
00:51:46
And I like everything from the beginning to wear Sergei throws,
00:51:51
the rifle, like a bat, to get rid of it.
00:51:53
The dogs are gone, Reese's, working on a snowshoe, and
00:51:56
Sergey slows down, so he can get his shoe done.
00:52:00
And I just like the description, it's just a solid.
00:52:04
Section. I think it's the most solid like
00:52:06
chapter in the whole book. Can I ask you a question there?
00:52:10
Because I had to reread it when he tosses that gun.
00:52:14
Am I right? That?
00:52:15
He would have shot reace. It just misfired or John and I
00:52:18
think award is, I did he toss it?
00:52:20
I think I have an even fight. Now, he went to pull the trigger
00:52:23
and he said empty, it was the loudest noise and the in the
00:52:26
entire day and it was a click instead of a bag.
00:52:30
And so he grabbed the rifle by the barrel and swing it like a
00:52:33
baseball bat and it went Into the distance, right?
00:52:36
Okay, the, the reason why I had to reread it, I was thinking it
00:52:40
would be kind of cool if he was, always the Lackey for Alexander
00:52:44
who got to go on these hunts. Yeah, but Sergei secretly wanted
00:52:47
to prove himself for sure. And this was the chance to have
00:52:50
a fair fight with a man, you know, just this grizzly bear of
00:52:53
a human. Yep.
00:52:54
And so, I was wondering if he threw away the gun under his own
00:52:58
volition just to say let's have it mono e mono, but yeah, that's
00:53:01
right. Okay, so interesting, I read it
00:53:03
as I read, It as a you thought, Mike?
00:53:05
I read it as if he wanted a fair fight.
00:53:09
Maybe she, maybe I'm sense. Maybe throw low, don't know.
00:53:12
I'm thinking about you write an exact line.
00:53:14
Yeah, he raised. I think maybe it also, like,
00:53:16
just this crappy Russian equipment, you know, of course
00:53:19
it's going to misfire and yeah, it's do it on purpose.
00:53:22
Maybe they knew he wanted to fuck opreis in the head and say,
00:53:26
you're dead. Now, let's fight.
00:53:28
I believe what it says is the loudest noise in the entire
00:53:30
forest was the sound of a, of a firing pin.
00:53:34
Go. Going forward on an empty
00:53:35
chamber. Yeah, you're right.
00:53:36
Okay. Okay.
00:53:39
Could still be on purpose though.
00:53:40
You know there could be some mind games going on there for
00:53:42
sure. Frequent was a really cool.
00:53:44
It was cool. It was cool either way.
00:53:45
It was cool. What about free space for you
00:53:47
guys? Chris - got to be the epilogue
00:53:51
been like it's freaking awesome. Like I said I want I wanted more
00:53:57
of it. I wanted to I want to just an
00:54:00
entire book of him going through the Wilderness and leading these
00:54:04
gifts for people being the Spectre in the night.
00:54:08
Yeah it's a lot for me. Good stuff.
00:54:12
I'm going to shout out my girl One More Time, Caroline
00:54:14
Hastings. Yeah, you're over and over
00:54:17
again. Yeah, this is Caroline likes in
00:54:18
love. Yeah, you are lovely.
00:54:22
And forgive me one more time. But let me wax poetic, for my
00:54:25
love here with one more quote, if you will.
00:54:28
It's just again, such a going, Chris, you know, I'm the quote
00:54:31
guy on the podcast. I never have this many.
00:54:33
The writing is that good. And I couldn't cut him down
00:54:36
either. Usually I try to get him two to
00:54:38
three lines. Maximum I had paragraphs here,
00:54:41
it was that good. I don't want to cut any of this.
00:54:45
So it's right when they're about to take up their positions and
00:54:49
defend the house. And Katie's thinking, quote,
00:54:51
Katie stared wide-eyed at the woman who just a day ago, had
00:54:55
seemed like a western version of Martha Stewart Asian trade.
00:54:58
Like, it was a good one. She had transformed into a
00:55:01
warrior, no one is coming. It's up to us.
00:55:03
Take your positions. Caroline open the bolt on
00:55:07
Herbie, rno rifle and pulled it back far enough to confirm that
00:55:10
there was a round in the chamber.
00:55:11
The magazine held five rounds of the venerable, gotta help me out
00:55:15
here Point 375 H&H. Yeah, no idea what.
00:55:18
That's exactly how you say that. Hey, you know, I knew that
00:55:22
another was in the chamber ready to go with Scout.
00:55:27
Listen, as this is Boy, Scout right here, 10 more Road, in a
00:55:30
leather belt around her waist and she stuffed another 10 in
00:55:33
her Pockets. The rifle had served her ER well
00:55:35
since he first picked it up in 1971 she is strapped up ready to
00:55:39
go at a moment's notice when she was practically Martha Stewart?
00:55:43
Just an hour ago. Yeah, I mean that that just goes
00:55:45
to show you how much, how well American life has been for her,
00:55:49
but how much she remembers from South Africa, rest?
00:55:53
Right? Yeah.
00:55:56
And that. And that's why I can't get rid
00:55:58
of True Believer. In my mind, what that first half
00:56:01
of the book did to establish this universe?
00:56:03
That would later be the Hastings class.
00:56:06
Means so much to me because we got to cover.
00:56:08
We got to do the covers and then I'm hoping we can end here boys,
00:56:11
with a little chat of our rankings, one through five of
00:56:14
the books knowing full. Well Chris the devil's hand is
00:56:17
not yet on the card for you, but I want to while we have Tyler
00:56:20
want to get the top five. Knowing this is in the first
00:56:22
spot. But before we get there, let's
00:56:25
round out the score card with some covers and Tyler a little
00:56:28
back story. Chris and I we've been a little
00:56:31
down on the jack car covers. It's not our favorite in.
00:56:35
The Thriller verse, but I got to say, these ones are good.
00:56:39
These ones are I think better really miss to.
00:56:41
So, Tyler, what do you think about these covers?
00:56:45
I don't mind the stock hardback covers.
00:56:47
I like they, I like the material.
00:56:50
They're made out of. I like how they're a little
00:56:51
reflective. I like how each one is a solid
00:56:53
color and then black, but for me, actually, out of the ones
00:56:58
that that, I'm looking at B, which is the paperback.
00:57:02
One is the is the best one. Yes.
00:57:05
Having. Yeah, I really liked all of the
00:57:09
ones that have had this like, paneling, I'm guessing that is
00:57:15
all the same reissue as a paperback and the Savage sudden
00:57:18
one it it reminds me of the epilogue you know like him like
00:57:23
some guy or wandering through Siberia or it could be anybody
00:57:27
you know one of The Trackers, someone who is being haunted you
00:57:32
know all the standing men guys, they're not bad.
00:57:35
They're not Not as egregious as some of the other ones that I
00:57:38
think like I agree with you Mike that.
00:57:40
These tend to be better. I like a, you have the mountains
00:57:43
and a lot of them, whether it's Siberia could also be Montana.
00:57:48
You know, these covers are been beside F.
00:57:51
I don't know what the hell's going on in death.
00:57:53
Like, is that is that James race is like a, it looks like a
00:57:57
vampire. Yeah, it looks like that toilet.
00:58:01
Looks like Twilight. Yeah, the thing I like the most
00:58:05
about, Is it reminds me of a very good.
00:58:08
David Morrell First Blood cover, where it's like all tan and then
00:58:13
out of nowhere, is John Rambo and this one reminds me a lot of
00:58:17
that. And I definitely think that's
00:58:20
that's Siberia or Med knee behind them.
00:58:24
But yeah, I like how I like. I just like the color and how it
00:58:27
works. And I like how the snow is out
00:58:29
of the stripes, and in the stripes, right?
00:58:32
Right, the black wasn't gold works.
00:58:34
I was just looking at the other Soft back releases to like the
00:58:37
first one for terminal list. Is this stripes with the Capitol
00:58:40
building? And the second one for True
00:58:42
Believer is like, the stripes are vertical and it has the
00:58:45
American flag with like an explosion at the bottom.
00:58:47
I think that was kind of weak. I think this is out of the
00:58:49
paperbacks is the best. Yeah, I think overall, we like
00:58:52
the paperbacks more you write the paneling and striping have
00:58:56
been our favorite in the series, but this I think is the best
00:58:58
one. Oh, and another thing Tyler, we
00:59:01
like to judge a cover by the book.
00:59:03
So a big criteria for us is Does it relate to the story?
00:59:08
And I kid, you not, sometimes they miss the main part of the
00:59:11
story on a cover and just give you absolutely Eric.
00:59:14
Crap. Yeah, and I just love that.
00:59:16
Every one of these is in the winter.
00:59:18
Every one of them is in the forest or Siberia.
00:59:21
A might even be Montana. I'm not sure.
00:59:23
But okay. So real quick look at e.
00:59:26
Yeah, that's Montana. Oh, yeah.
00:59:28
And I was thinking, that could also be Thorns cabin on the
00:59:31
Idaho. Yeah.
00:59:32
Border could bear with Dmitri. Imagine if he just tortured
00:59:35
Dimitri, right? Back there.
00:59:36
There's none that I hate other than F.
00:59:38
So the rest of the river, he said, alright, so that's a, I'm
00:59:43
going to solid 4.5 a little early you guys.
00:59:45
Whoa, that's pretty high. Okay.
00:59:48
Probably do like, 444 be. I think I'm gonna go down to
00:59:55
three and a half. While I like these more than the
00:59:58
other ones in the series. They're not that great for me
01:00:04
and see Chris. We got a running man, see is
01:00:08
just to flynny and for me like that's a Vince Flynn stock image
01:00:11
right there with the running man.
01:00:13
I'm just surprised. There's no power lines and that
01:00:15
will be for Rog listeners, but there should be power lines in
01:00:19
that picture. That looks like an early Vince
01:00:21
right there. And I'm sorry.
01:00:22
One last thing. I'm digging it on.
01:00:23
So I got to go down to three and a half faces.
01:00:26
Tyler, I got a face for you. I gotta go Jakob.
01:00:29
You like, I got over the putting a On the cover, which I'm not a
01:00:32
big fan of having an actual body or, you know, a person too many
01:00:37
faces once you add the face. I don't want it on Thriller
01:00:41
cover. So unfortunately a which is
01:00:43
really cool artistically. And design-wise you see half a
01:00:47
face FEC of face b. D got a little too much of a
01:00:51
face. So yeah.
01:00:53
Sorry guys, going three and a half on these covers real quick.
01:00:56
If if either you guys have Google open just Google first
01:01:00
Blood novel cover, The second picture is one of my is probably
01:01:04
my favorite novel cover. It should be, first is in Black
01:01:08
lettering with, like, the tan background, and then blowww.
01:01:10
Yeah. And so at the top, it has John
01:01:13
Rambo in a flannel with a rifle, elephant, is that that will
01:01:17
cover is so it's a great cover. I like how they are like sort of
01:01:21
dips down into the blood and like yeah, that's cool dude,
01:01:25
that's 100%. That's a great cover.
01:01:28
It's simple, it's very simple. Yeah, I like how small John
01:01:31
Rambo is on it. Like he doesn't take he doesn't
01:01:33
take the the spotlight away from the title and I like that one.
01:01:37
I won't say is has a face problem either.
01:01:40
It's small enough and it's like clip already enough.
01:01:43
Yeah, no face problem there. That's a great one. so, Nice.
01:01:49
Alright, so, what does that bring our totals to Tyler with a
01:01:52
very strong 48 points out of 50? Chris right behind with a forty
01:01:58
seven and a half. Mm!
01:02:00
Unfortunately I am usually the critic a bit lower at 45 and a
01:02:04
half. He didn't make it for the
01:02:06
critics. Have you ever given anything
01:02:08
perfect scores? He just did okay no Pod without
01:02:11
me I did it without Chris because I read a book that was
01:02:14
so good. I had to jump on the microphone
01:02:16
and do it. Sons of Valor, dude, Andrews and
01:02:21
Wilson. Brian Andrews and Jeff Wilson
01:02:23
are a tag-team duo, their sons of Valor series.
01:02:27
There's only two of them. Okay, they're almost almost the
01:02:32
perfect two books. I'll have to add Intel y,
01:02:36
Zachary then, dude. Yes, I jumped on the mic.
01:02:39
I was thinking out loud. I'm like I'm not going to force
01:02:43
this to be a 50 out of 50, but there's a good chance if I think
01:02:46
out loud right now, I'm going to get myself.
01:02:48
Myself to the conclusion of 50 out of 50 in and it happened.
01:02:51
They're that good cool. Yeah.
01:02:54
So if we go off all my numbers like then this is the
01:02:59
highest-rated book which I would agree with.
01:03:00
I think like this is there if you I ranked herbalist a point
01:03:05
above True, Believer. And then in the blood was my
01:03:08
lowest which somebody like I remember enjoying that book.
01:03:12
What or why? I was so down and on the
01:03:15
scorecard but these ones are so good right?
01:03:17
But I think yeah, the first three are definitely the better
01:03:21
of the novel's. I think I agree with but I would
01:03:25
flip terminal lists and True Believer.
01:03:26
I think it would go Savage sun to believer terminal list and
01:03:30
then in the blood a time I can track that will set in yet
01:03:32
because I have to ready yet. So terminal list is dropping to
01:03:35
the three spot for you. Is that what I'm hearing?
01:03:37
Yeah, I really enjoyed the first half of the terror of True
01:03:39
Believer you know. Okay so that's why I ordered
01:03:43
him. Stick it to it.
01:03:44
Okay, for me, it's a Savage Sun terminal list, then in the
01:03:49
blood, then True Believer, then Devil's Hand.
01:03:52
Okay okay, okay, okay by scorecard, I would have terminal
01:03:58
list in first place. Savage sun and then True
01:04:02
Believer. In the blood and devils and I
01:04:06
think I'm going to bump True Believer to the second spot.
01:04:09
Just Nostalgia sake. I'm a I'm an originalist.
01:04:13
I like debuts and their follow-up.
01:04:16
Like if you give me that one-two punch, that means a lot to me.
01:04:19
And so I am going in order terminal is True Believer.
01:04:23
Savage sun is my my top 3. I get it just I can terminal
01:04:28
assist. I just remember opening it for
01:04:29
the first time. Yes, been blown away?
01:04:33
Yeah. Now, since I now, see that's how
01:04:34
I was too, and in my opinion, Devil's Hand, even though it
01:04:37
might be at the bottom of my list, it's still good.
01:04:40
Like, I've read it once listened to it twice.
01:04:43
They're still good, really good parts of it.
01:04:45
It's just, it's good. It's just I could see how Mike
01:04:50
is annoyed by the topic, but maybe try and give it another
01:04:53
read. Because post post that
01:04:56
lifestyle, that it is, it's better.
01:04:59
It's, I don't know, it's different.
01:05:02
I think that I will read it and we'll have you back on Thailand.
01:05:06
Awesome. Great, awesome.
01:05:07
I'm going to be more open and I'm going to read it with an
01:05:09
open mind, and I'm going to come out of fresh and give it an
01:05:12
honest score on the scorecard. So sounds good, I will drop my
01:05:15
biases from my previous read sounds good.
01:05:18
I will also say Savage Sun though, it slip to my third
01:05:21
spot. I will recognize it is perhaps
01:05:23
his best written book. I actually think it might be the
01:05:26
best written book, just all the quotes I pulled out, right.
01:05:28
Right. Like I think it's the best
01:05:30
written book and I could see why it's a fan favorite and probably
01:05:33
the highest-rated in the series. So yeah, I get that.
01:05:36
It's just me personally, I like the originals of things.
01:05:40
So Well, Tyler thanks so much. It's like always a blast having
01:05:45
you on will bring you back real soon.
01:05:47
And is there a date for Only The Dead?
01:05:50
Do we know when we're going to be getting that?
01:05:53
Because we'll have to chat, you know, in the lead-up to that.
01:05:57
It just says spring 2023. Sorry.
01:05:59
Okay, look, somebody come out and like april-ish, right?
01:06:03
Yeah, the last one was slaughtered for April, got
01:06:05
pushed to June. Oh, here, I sit Pony made for
01:06:09
May 16. Okay, are we good time?
01:06:12
I think they try to beat the Summer Rush, you know, like Brad
01:06:15
Thor's of Summer novel. Kyle Mills is post summer.
01:06:19
I think we, they try to open up with Jack, usually a little
01:06:22
little earlier, so, Cool. Good stuff, boys.
01:06:26
A lot of fun. I will thank you.
01:06:28
Tyler, for couple of the Pod. This is great.
01:06:30
Yeah. Hour and 47 minutes.
01:06:32
Marathon salvage. Some of that was great as
01:06:34
awesome. Thanks for having me on.
01:06:35
I appreciate it. We have to thank our patrons
01:06:42
big. Shout-out to our special
01:06:43
operators. Cherry have our special agents
01:06:45
Darryl. Kevin George Matt Dawn.
01:06:47
Dennis Peggy, cathode ray, Bridget, Jeff and Mark and will
01:06:51
be back in January, covered more through their podcast.
01:06:54
So look forward to us in the New Year.
01:06:57
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01:07:02
You can find us online at Thriller pod.com, or using the
01:07:06
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01:07:10
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