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00:00:15
Hey guys. I'm Chris and I'm Mike and
00:00:20
welcome back to this week's No Limits.
00:00:23
The Thriller podcast. How you doing today, Mike?
00:00:27
I'm good because I got to talk with Ward Larson but Chris, you
00:00:31
missed another date with Ward Larson.
00:00:33
I think we've had them on three times.
00:00:35
Have you been on for one of those?
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Right? What I think he's I think he's I
00:00:40
think he's actually been on four times four times now.
00:00:42
Yeah, I'm sorry. Warden, Ulysses, I'm sorry, it's
00:00:46
nothing against you. I enjoyed our first conversation
00:00:49
together. Literally every city, I think
00:00:51
like the the other whether it's three or two other times, you
00:00:55
know it's just been some of them.
00:00:57
My kids when I was 6 the last week, actually, the entire
00:01:00
family had got strapped and so I didn't realize it at the time,
00:01:04
but when I put my kids to bed at night and I just fell asleep,
00:01:09
that was the beginning of my sickness and then they got worse
00:01:11
throughout the week so, you know better now.
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But, you know, I always would say, is that we need to do, you
00:01:17
know, I actually read this book. So we need to sit down and
00:01:20
record a podcast about it because I thought it was very
00:01:22
good. Yeah.
00:01:23
And I actually haven't even listened to your conversation.
00:01:26
I'm looking forward to And when this publish, when you publish
00:01:29
this episode. So yeah, we had a blast, you're
00:01:31
going to enjoy to, I'm kind of glad you get to be kind of like
00:01:34
a fan of the podcast here and listen to one of our episodes
00:01:38
with fresh eyes. And you know, what's coming?
00:01:41
There's something big in this book and I don't want to spoil
00:01:44
it for anybody. You've got to pick up deep fake
00:01:48
actually. We're also recording this right
00:01:49
here on his publication day is book.
00:01:52
Came out on March 14, I guess, pie day.
00:01:55
These authors love pie, they are big.
00:01:57
Releases on, everyone can eat their round treats, learn of
00:02:01
some mathematical Concepts and have a thriller.
00:02:03
I don't know. My school.
00:02:04
Does that did your school do that growing up?
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Now, it's a big thing in school Pi Day is Like a Holiday where
00:02:09
everyone brings in like circular treats and they get to eat them
00:02:12
on Pi Day. It was big in my grade school,
00:02:17
okay? And then in high school there's
00:02:19
one teacher Who Loved by day and so he would he would bring in
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like all kinds of Pie Pizza. He's bringing pizza pie, you
00:02:26
know, cherry pie. The kids were all jazzed up and
00:02:30
sugared up to, I'll be honest with you and then I asked them
00:02:32
to explain to me what pie is and they still need get it.
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So the whole point of the celebration is to learn some
00:02:40
math here, guys, I used to be able to recite it pretty far
00:02:45
out. Now I like a nose, like three
00:02:46
point one, four seven. So I will say one of the kids
00:02:51
one the Pi Day contest and got to three hundred digits. 350
00:02:55
something digits. I'm like that's insane.
00:02:57
Zane 300 days while it's not even 7:00, it's 359265. 350
00:03:05
look at this guy. Well you know has to be good
00:03:07
with numbers a pilot because in the cockpit they've got to
00:03:10
understand all the data and Ward's Larson getting back on
00:03:15
track here. I asked him, of course where
00:03:17
he's been flying, he makes an apology for Southwest.
00:03:19
He was he was flying during the holiday season 2022 with
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Southwest, we talked about a lot of things but nothing more
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important. Then deep fake, what a book if
00:03:30
you haven't checked it out, definitely grab a copy of this.
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Ward is moving away from his David's Layton series which on
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the podcast, we absolutely love. I think a totally underrated
00:03:43
series. I see no reason.
00:03:45
It shouldn't be up there with the Mitch wraps, the Scott
00:03:48
horvath's, it's just a great series but the Assassin series
00:03:51
featuring David Slaton. But Ward had a story cooking and
00:03:55
we talked about, you know, those covid days.
00:03:57
As were the brain was running and he came up with this plot
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wanted to get it out on paper. And man, it is fantastic.
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We've got a politician who Chris.
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I know you and I would vote for if he were real we've got a plot
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twist. I would put it up there with a
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howdy twist. You know, we covered Chris
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Howard ebooks. He always gives us the howdy
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twist this. Book's got one of those.
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It's got a deep fake, I'll put it that way.
00:04:23
So guys, check out deep fake by Ward Larsen, there is a spoiler
00:04:28
warning about halfway through our conversation.
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I'm very clear when the spoiler warning starts because I just
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had to talk to him about a couple of things he did with
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this book, so cut it off at the spoiler warning.
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If you did not finish deep fake, if you have, I think you will
00:04:44
very much enjoy my chat with World Larson.
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Today, we welcome back to No Limits.
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The Thriller podcast, a very good friend, and our first
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author that we ever had here on. No Limits.
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Welcome back. Ward Larsen.
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Hey, Mike, how are you? Good, good.
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How you been since we last chatted?
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Did you say April laughs? Yes, I think it was last April
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busy but all is good. And, you know, we have to ask
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you. You fly anywhere.
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Interesting lately. Good stories.
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Crazy. Passengers are, you know, not so
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much interesting. But yeah, I fly for Southwest.
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I made it, and I was involved in that whole Christmas meltdown.
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I was out flying that whole time.
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So, okay, yeah, so my apologies to anybody out there is affected
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by that. We drop the ball on, tell you
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the line employees. We were out there.
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Trying trying to make a word is best.
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We could I believe it. I'm sure it's not the employees
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on the ground doing the everyday work.
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I'm sure it's something with management or Administration.
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Yeah, something up there. Yeah, they've neglecting some
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things over the years. But you know, I was thinking, I
00:06:02
forgot about your connection with Southwest and that was your
00:06:04
airline, but I thought about you when the craziness was going on
00:06:08
I'm like what Ward's take on this would be?
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I forgot. It was Southwest that you're
00:06:12
with. Uh-huh.
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Yeah. Okay.
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Okay, well things are back to normal now.
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Write a little bit better. Yes.
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They're they're still getting better and I think yeah.
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Repairs are being made to the system.
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May. Yeah, we got to the point where,
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you know, we would get some external of bad weather or some
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kind of Technology issue. And when that happens you end up
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canceling a lot of flight which yeah that happens all the time
00:06:37
that happens every year to all Airlines here and there.
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But you have to recover from me. You know, you have been able to
00:06:42
get over it and we didn't have the capacity to do that.
00:06:45
And so I think we're fixing it. We've also had these crazy
00:06:50
snowstorms up north and some cold snaps rolling in to those
00:06:54
children. Generally have an effect but I
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haven't gotten involved in those.
00:06:58
Yeah, I've been kind of avoided so that has been an issue for
00:07:01
me. But yeah, I I've seen him from
00:07:04
down here in sunny Florida. It's actually been worn down
00:07:06
here. It's been it's been quite warm
00:07:08
for February and March. Yeah, we might get lucky with
00:07:13
this one. Our first year at least in the
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15. Plus years I've been in the DC
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area with no snow yet. We always have that one or two a
00:07:21
couple of inches or even a dusting and it's been right here
00:07:24
all this year, so we'll see. Yeah, well, we're here today to
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talk about a really exciting project for you.
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A standalone novel, deep fake is just an absolute must-read.
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It could be up there for Of the books of the year.
00:07:42
I mean there's just been so many but I'm really excited to talk
00:07:45
to you today about this shift away from David Slayton
00:07:48
temporarily because you know we're getting the Assassin
00:07:52
series back later in the year and we can definitely write
00:07:54
that. But where did this idea come
00:07:56
from to move away from your main character and story line?
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And come up with this? Explosive plot for a standalone
00:08:04
novel deep fake. Well, the plot of style, this
00:08:07
kind of cooking in the back of my head for a year, but that's,
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that's one of the things you have, you know, as a writer is,
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you get involved in series and that's kind of what the
00:08:14
publisher wants. So, you get these other ideas
00:08:17
that you would like, to develop and make a book out of, but a
00:08:20
lot of times just don't have the time or the backing to do it.
00:08:24
So I kind of got lucky in a way that covid came along because I
00:08:28
think I might have mentioned this last year where the
00:08:31
airlines were. I was so fly by the airline so
00:08:33
you know, that's my second full-time job.
00:08:35
But they were over staff during covid because fine fell off a
00:08:39
cliff. So they gave everybody the
00:08:41
option of taking some time off and I did that.
00:08:43
So, I didn't go out of the house for 11 months and didn't fly.
00:08:47
I pretty much stay home because nobody would go out.
00:08:49
Anyway, this is back at, you know, 2028 2020, I guess, and I
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just stayed on for 11 months. I wrote two books in a novella,
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which just goes to prove you chain a writer to his desk,
00:09:01
while actually. So I had the time to do it and
00:09:06
Publisher was gracious enough to say?
00:09:07
Yeah, we could do two books in the year.
00:09:09
So I got to do a standalone, which I've done one before, they
00:09:13
let me do that once before back with cutting-edge about five
00:09:15
years ago. But yeah.
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So I got to do this book and get that idea in my head.
00:09:21
I got to put it to paper and it was fine.
00:09:22
It's really refreshing. And the rider to kind of get off
00:09:26
base and do something a little different.
00:09:28
Not that I don't enjoy, right? And it's like books.
00:09:30
But it's kind of reset to do something a little different,
00:09:35
When a pilot's not flying, they're cooking up stories about
00:09:38
how you know, undercover agents could bring down America.
00:09:42
Yeah yeah. That's the others long flight.
00:09:45
You got to do something up, their plot.
00:09:48
That's good. Well, yeah, I mean, just listen
00:09:50
to this blurb on your website for this book.
00:09:53
Absolute power, meets The Manchurian Candidate in this
00:09:56
explosive political thriller from USA USA.
00:09:59
Today, best-selling author, Ward Larsen Wow, absolute power
00:10:04
Manchurian Candidate you're being compared to some Heavy
00:10:07
Hitters here. I saw another one that said it's
00:10:09
like Mitch rap meets The Manchurian Candidate.
00:10:12
Some of these things have they influenced you in the way, you
00:10:15
tell stories and the way you bring these threats to the
00:10:18
Forefront of your books. Yeah it's funny that Mitch rap.
00:10:21
Do you talk about? I'm not sure where that came
00:10:23
from. That was going to be on a cover
00:10:25
for a while but then somebody for Matrix so much somehow is
00:10:29
that you it almost makes it sound like it's a mitch Rap
00:10:32
Book. And I did what we came up with
00:10:34
it. I didn't really read it that way
00:10:36
because this was by my publisher came up with that quote as yeah,
00:10:40
I guess. You could see it that way.
00:10:42
So we actually did put that one on the cover of the book for
00:10:45
that reason because I didn't want to, you know, make it sound
00:10:48
like it's actually a trap. We're just trying to compare it
00:10:50
to that, you know, iconic character.
00:10:53
So, yeah, which makes sense with some of the action scenes and I
00:10:57
think I saw that from Goodreads. So I think was just a fan that
00:10:59
was making that comparison and their spot, okay?
00:11:02
And later, okay, we're going to get to a spoiler section.
00:11:05
We could dig into the actual characters and the plot and and
00:11:09
guys, if you haven't read it yet and you're listening to this,
00:11:12
you must will tell you when to pause for the spoilers because
00:11:15
there's a character that's very much straight out of the Vince
00:11:20
Flynn Universe in the way it sees crafted and some of the
00:11:23
politicking on Capitol Hill and it's just really amazing how you
00:11:28
did that but that's going to come later in the spoiler
00:11:30
section. So you talked About this plot
00:11:34
Lines been cooking at where do you even begin thinking about a
00:11:40
plot that's this long in the making.
00:11:43
I mean, it's almost in. Here's another tag line.
00:11:45
The cold war is back but for some, it never ended right.
00:11:49
Where did all this come from? And I know you can't be too
00:11:52
specific yet, but it did it all come at once.
00:11:55
Was it an aha moment. This is deep fake connection, or
00:11:58
was it slow to simmer? I think I'm too slow.
00:12:02
I think it was a bit. And pieces and it kind of came
00:12:04
together and sometimes when you're putting together a plot
00:12:06
like that, you know, you had this kind of general idea of how
00:12:11
the main part of the buccos and other things just sort of tend
00:12:15
to fall in place and the whole Cold War thing that kind of just
00:12:18
fell in place. Because, you know, just you look
00:12:21
at how old these people were when they grew up.
00:12:24
And what environment they grew up in some of the characters
00:12:27
were booked grew up back during the Cold War and that was a very
00:12:30
different time in Russia. Reject from Ephesus by the
00:12:34
government over there. So, you know, the first part of
00:12:37
this book, you really don't see the big connection to it but
00:12:40
eventually you do. And so yeah, it's there's a
00:12:43
definite connection of the Cold War and guess that's where it
00:12:47
came from but yeah, it's bits and pieces.
00:12:49
They kind of come together here and there and there really is
00:12:52
satisfying as a writer when you get that aha moment.
00:12:55
But yeah, I could connect this to that and it all sort of was
00:12:58
in together. Doesn't always work that way.
00:13:00
Sometimes you got to work for it but yeah, it's sad.
00:13:02
Just following what does come together?
00:13:05
You know, we've already compared it to The Manchurian Candidate
00:13:08
or Mitch rap but another one that comes to my mind is the
00:13:11
Americans how that transports you back to Cold War era
00:13:16
Suburbia, outside, Washington, d.c., actually I think it was
00:13:19
also said, in Fairfax, did you see that show?
00:13:22
But yeah, I didn't see the whole thing.
00:13:24
Yes, I did see quite a few episodes of, I couldn't stop
00:13:27
making comparisons between some of the things going on there
00:13:30
with the illegal program and you can read all about these
00:13:33
long-term plans from the Russians.
00:13:35
And there was this other one. My wife works for Johns Hopkins
00:13:39
at their school of international studies and recently one of the
00:13:44
alumni who she's been in contact with, you know, at through the
00:13:47
alumni office, he was caught as a deep-cover plant who got his
00:13:53
degree from Hopkins in international relations.
00:13:57
But now, the Russians were trying to get him a position at
00:14:00
the Hague and they wanted to get him involved and he was almost
00:14:04
going to get hired and he had a position there and he was Moving
00:14:07
out to the Netherlands and the Dutch intelligence Services,
00:14:10
caught him and I think it was at an airport, they saw that he had
00:14:14
notes on him of his backstory. He was an orphan and he was
00:14:18
raised in Brazil but he also spoke Chinese and Portuguese.
00:14:21
And he also knew Russian and people thought he was Russian.
00:14:24
But he tried to say he was Brazilian and his story was all
00:14:27
mixed up. They took him in and turns out
00:14:29
he was a Russian plant and they activated him to try to get him
00:14:32
in the Hague to have some eavesdropping on what what
00:14:35
conversations are being had. Add around Ukraine and I feel
00:14:39
like a plot line like that is so close to some of the story lines
00:14:42
that you've created and specifically the one here in
00:14:44
deep fake white. I think one of the things that
00:14:47
brings up in about always felt this is that the Russians and to
00:14:51
a lesser degree of Chinese. They're very good at playing the
00:14:54
long game. They had these Authority
00:14:56
authoritarian figures in power, who are looking, you know, a
00:14:59
generation ahead. Whereas we never looked more
00:15:02
than two years, one election cycle, I had.
00:15:05
And so we really Have trouble playing a long game, and many
00:15:09
parts of our government, our intelligence agencies because
00:15:11
we're always so caught up in the moment and the near term.
00:15:14
So they're much better in us than waiting things out having
00:15:18
the patience and really letting long-term employees like that.
00:15:21
Play out. I think patients is the word
00:15:24
there because these are countries with thousands of
00:15:28
years and tens of thousands of years of Empire.
00:15:31
And we've been experimenting for nearly 300 in doing that.
00:15:36
And so, yeah, the patient's, the long game long-term planning and
00:15:39
a political system that favors that.
00:15:42
Yeah. And you can see it today because
00:15:43
Putin really isn't worried about my being in power, 10 years from
00:15:46
now. It is not, that was probably
00:15:49
going to be very bad for him, but he can, he can play this
00:15:52
Ukraine thing. As long as he wants, he really
00:15:54
doesn't have a lot of media pressure to back off, and
00:15:58
whereas the West is probably going to grow tired ever more
00:16:01
quickly. So, he's playing a long game.
00:16:03
That's what you want to do. Is, wait us out at Ukraine and
00:16:06
now he may do it. Time will tell It's crazy.
00:16:10
Just today, I'm a geography teacher and it's a middle school
00:16:14
classroom, but we're talking the Cold War.
00:16:16
That's the kids. I said, hey, you know, during
00:16:18
this whole time period we're studying you know who's Rising
00:16:21
through the ranks in the KGB and who is really honing his skills
00:16:24
as an intelligence officer and a spy and you know getting
00:16:29
promoted really running a lot of Soviet intelligence.
00:16:34
It was that ago that's a name. You might recognize Vladimir
00:16:37
Putin and they're like what and So, even in these young kids
00:16:41
could pick up on it, that's crazy how so much of his
00:16:44
presidency. And Prime ministership is
00:16:46
related to This Cold War era as we're talking about and it comes
00:16:50
to a head in your book, you know, the to merge the past in
00:16:53
the present and it leads to the 6th Dynamic plot that has real
00:16:57
ramifications. So you decided to put this book
00:17:01
during an election cycle. And I've been clamoring for that
00:17:06
lately in a few different series.
00:17:08
We read even on the podcast. Doing Kyle Mills, Mitch wrap
00:17:12
storylines and breadth or books, and even the Jack car books,
00:17:16
which have been pretty light on the president and executive
00:17:19
office side of things. I really appreciate how this
00:17:22
book put us inside the Beltway during an election cycle.
00:17:27
Who were the Power Players? How are they posturing?
00:17:31
What was your research like to really nail the the buzz in DC
00:17:36
during an election cycle? Well, that was back in early
00:17:39
2012. See, I wrote this was kind of
00:17:41
during an election cycle. That's all kind of hit my per
00:17:44
processor. So it was going on, you know, in
00:17:46
the background. So I was kind of following it
00:17:48
from a distance and I think it's a couple of things.
00:17:51
I kind of got two thing. One thing I do is I don't get
00:17:55
political, I'm not democrat or republican.
00:17:57
I just stay away from that. That's not the point of the
00:17:59
whole thing. The point of this is, you know,
00:18:02
how well, do we know these people who were electing and to
00:18:05
government and this day and age. So much of it is John from
00:18:10
social media, you know, it's not and how true is that?
00:18:15
We all know, Auntie Peg itself, turn deep fake, you know, you
00:18:18
can make up anything you want about anybody and you know, what
00:18:21
can you believe? Can we see what?
00:18:23
We're what we're seeing online. We're reading online.
00:18:27
So it's, that's a big part of the book is trying to determine
00:18:31
do. We really know these people and
00:18:34
somebody like, you know, the character in a book price
00:18:37
Ridgeway. He's a he's a secondary
00:18:39
political player. He's a congressman and he's you
00:18:41
know successful but he just started out but then something
00:18:44
happens that involves him overnight into this sensation on
00:18:47
social media and his name recognition goes off the chart.
00:18:51
And you know we do as humans we do that we fall for that kind of
00:18:56
thing. We always ask and the
00:18:59
electronics. The social media is just kind of
00:19:01
accelerated that old Trend. So that was a big part of the
00:19:06
idea behind the book is, how how fragile that is that.
00:19:10
Lady, we evaluate these people, and let's say that that go go to
00:19:15
the most recent election, George Santa and I was just about.
00:19:18
So here we are. Who made that guy?
00:19:20
Who did the Oppo research there is entire resume.
00:19:23
It was a fraud and nobody figured it out after the
00:19:26
election. Either way, you were talking, I
00:19:29
was just about to say, and no. Jorge Santos is not the main
00:19:32
character and defend, but it just goes to prove.
00:19:38
It's like obviously Lee. That's almost like we're
00:19:41
watching something out of a movie or reading a book.
00:19:43
It's just yeah bizarre, it's just insane.
00:19:48
And you wrote that book, you've you you knew that was coming and
00:19:51
and 2020 and then this happens to and it two years later, two
00:19:55
and a half years later. It's like all these other
00:19:57
authors, predicting, the future like we call Kyle Nostradamus,
00:20:00
you know, with that? He's predicted.
00:20:02
Yeah, you know, we're talking about DC and inside the Beltway
00:20:07
might, as well. Make a plug here before we
00:20:09
really get into the spoiler section.
00:20:11
You also have a David Slaton book coming out later in the
00:20:14
year. Am I, right?
00:20:15
That also is taking place in DC and Only also involves the
00:20:18
president from what I saw in the blurb.
00:20:21
The beginning of the book. Yes.
00:20:22
Yeah, it does have some decency aspect and some political
00:20:26
aspect. But yeah, it's a slight in book
00:20:29
of heart and Satan doesn't spend much time in DC and others said
00:20:33
in the Far East and that's where he heads off to but yeah the
00:20:38
beginning definitely takes place in d.c.
00:20:41
All right and that one is called Assassin.
00:20:44
That is assassins Mark assassins Mark and am I right over Ember
00:20:48
November 28th. Yep.
00:20:50
Yeah. Okay great.
00:20:52
Well, word. I really want to ask you some
00:20:54
deep questions about deep fake. So let's give a spoiler warning
00:20:58
here. If you haven't read the book,
00:21:00
pick it up. Oh, and there is the audio
00:21:02
version coming out on publication date, as well.
00:21:05
I heard the little snippet of that.
00:21:07
Have you worked with this narrator before?
00:21:09
This is a different guy. Usually had a guy named p.j.
00:21:12
Aquamarine, the Assassin books, but we thought for the
00:21:14
Standalone might be good idea. You somebody different.
00:21:17
So that we addition to a couple of people, and this is the thing
00:21:21
we came up with Yeah like yeah I listen to that one minute teaser
00:21:26
that was posted on your social media and I think on the website
00:21:29
and it brought me back to a really early but very important
00:21:34
conversation of price ridgeway's wife.
00:21:37
And so a lot of this book has these Clues.
00:21:41
There's seeds being planted and Brands.
00:21:44
There's a trail for the reader and I don't think I picked up on
00:21:48
that. And then once this reveal
00:21:50
happened, it was so much. Much fun to go back and look for
00:21:53
the breadcrumbs. You left for us.
00:21:55
So yeah, spoiler warning, here we go.
00:21:58
Deep fake is not what we thought it was.
00:22:02
Where did this come from to make a real life?
00:22:04
Deep fake to have a deep sleeper agent who is someone's twin who
00:22:09
was groomed for the presidency? That is just it's incredible.
00:22:13
I've never heard of a story like this and it really took me back.
00:22:16
So what was it like creating this big reveal?
00:22:19
Yeah, well, yeah, the just that that's the Yes, the Big Papi
00:22:23
hide there is, you know, evil twin kind of thing.
00:22:26
Could you really pull that off? So you kind of take that, you
00:22:29
know, that male element and then go back and say, well how could
00:22:33
I pull it off? You go back.
00:22:36
And a lot of the story is told through his wife's point of view
00:22:39
and his daughter and just, you know, anything will could you be
00:22:43
married to somebody like that and not know, how difficult
00:22:47
would it be for them to impersonate and, you know,
00:22:50
during the book I have Have them mainly separated after that
00:22:54
point where he takes place of the guy, he's really kind of
00:22:57
keeps his distance and he's not around the house much and you
00:23:00
know, figure out well, that's why I eventually because he
00:23:03
knows it's not going to work forever.
00:23:05
I can't pull this off with her forever and ever because it's
00:23:08
just not going to work but he's, you know, he just wants to get
00:23:11
elected and then we'll deal with the rest later.
00:23:13
But yeah, it's, you know, it's hard when you had that big
00:23:17
reveal on the middle to believe the breadcrumbs breadcrumbs as
00:23:20
you say, but not gay. It away too early.
00:23:23
So you got to kind of do a little may be misleading and you
00:23:26
know his wife's wondering is that the headaches is that the
00:23:29
blast easy? Because the subject to is he
00:23:32
having an affair all those things and you know he kind of
00:23:36
think I could, she would think, you know what the heck's going
00:23:38
on. Something's not right.
00:23:39
But I can't think what it is. Who would think?
00:23:42
What a really is, right? You know, II, there was actually
00:23:46
something very different that started getting me thinking that
00:23:50
way. It was when deep fake in terms
00:23:53
of a deep fake video was mentioned.
00:23:56
So early. In the beginning, I said to
00:23:59
myself, I said, I think that's a ruse.
00:24:02
I think that's a distraction because, you know, one of the,
00:24:07
one of the characters, I think someone in the political office
00:24:09
is like, oh, it could be a deep fake video, where someone makes
00:24:12
a fake video about Ryan. I'm like, that's not going to be
00:24:14
it. I was like, that's too easy.
00:24:16
It's too easy Ward's. Got something in store for us
00:24:19
and so and then II clued in. And it's funny because an early
00:24:24
one about the scar read. Very, just like, strange, it's
00:24:29
his interaction with your life and the comes back from a run
00:24:32
and his leg is cut. She's like, oh, that's
00:24:34
interesting. I didn't see that and you sure
00:24:37
you don't need to go get that looked at.
00:24:38
He's like, no, it's fine. I was something just, you don't
00:24:42
know what's happening, but something that's, it's uneasy
00:24:44
with you. So, it's almost like you're in
00:24:46
the wife's perspective. You're in her shoes, because
00:24:49
she's uneasy we, as the Reader are uneasy in your tables on
00:24:52
that trip right now is the end of chapter one.
00:24:55
So, yeah, right out the back. She's starting to feel like the
00:24:59
right, but that's okay. Having a bad day.
00:25:02
I will say I then, with his, the big one, where she puts it
00:25:05
together is a shoulder, his combat injury, where he can't
00:25:09
use one arm. Yeah, right yet.
00:25:12
And, and then there's a bunch of people looking at the videotape,
00:25:14
playing it over and over, and I'm waiting for them to see that
00:25:18
one detail and nobody sees it earlier on.
00:25:20
On but it's the wife later in the book.
00:25:23
Who picks you up on it? Yeah.
00:25:24
Again that's the reader because I felt like I was in the
00:25:28
detectives office watching this replay. 70 80 100 times racking
00:25:33
my brain yet. I just don't see it.
00:25:35
Yeah, when the wife sees it, we also see it because she knows
00:25:39
I'm so intimately. It just stands right out to her
00:25:42
but everybody else. Nobody else really knows his
00:25:44
limitations like she does. So yeah I think that's going to
00:25:49
make this a very fun book. To reread.
00:25:52
I think I would really have fun going back.
00:25:55
Yeah, it's like a movie, right? Once, you know, the twist in the
00:25:58
final plot. Yeah, you can go back and what
00:26:00
the actors are doing and how they're pulling it off.
00:26:03
It is extraordinary and I think we would see that re reading
00:26:07
this book. Hopefully.
00:26:08
Yeah, that's the kind of book. I was trying to write for sure,
00:26:12
for sure. And then there's also Mandy a
00:26:16
character who Gets written. Oh, and by the way, what a
00:26:20
coincidence. Did you see that email.
00:26:22
I had written you about Mandy trainer or last name.
00:26:25
Oh no, I have a, I have an in-law name trainers.
00:26:29
That's where I got the name trainer from.
00:26:31
That's so funny. Yeah, and it's a unique spelling
00:26:33
with Tre. Ano are, that's my wife's name
00:26:37
and her family name. And the funny thing is, they
00:26:40
live in Fairfax County where Bryce Ridgeway would be the
00:26:43
congressman representing. Yeah.
00:26:48
Pure coincidence. There are real trainers living.
00:26:52
There are my wife's side of the family.
00:26:53
Yes. They're from Grand Rapids on
00:26:56
both our ends. That's too funny.
00:26:57
Yeah a lot of people hear the name and they think trainer
00:27:01
spelled like you know, Sports training for sneakers.
00:27:03
Yeah. So Mandy is great and Bryce
00:27:08
absolutely respects her, she respects him.
00:27:11
They have a really good professional relationship and
00:27:14
she's just kick ass at her job as the campaign manager, right?
00:27:17
And right. Right eventually, possibly
00:27:20
angling to be a larger Chief of Staff or get him on a committee
00:27:23
position, and have more power. Kind of curious your decision
00:27:27
to. I would say drop her but looking
00:27:30
back post reveal, it makes sense.
00:27:33
Yes, out of character for Bryce. Was that something you were
00:27:36
going for? Yeah, it is out of character for
00:27:39
him. So that's just another unease
00:27:41
for the reader because it seems like he has a good relationship
00:27:44
this woman. She really likes him and it's
00:27:46
just hits her out of the blue and he He, you know, he, they
00:27:50
offer her a job. The RNC offers him offers her a
00:27:54
job, they will keep her on, you know, we just can't have around
00:27:57
the forward operating TV, but we'll keep her on give her a job
00:28:00
somewhere. And he tells her, no, we just
00:28:02
got to make it a clean cup. So he's being duplicity said
00:28:06
there. So you can, you know why?
00:28:07
But you can tell he's dumping her and you can't really see a
00:28:10
good reason for because she's a good employee.
00:28:12
And, you know, so, you know, that's just one more little
00:28:17
bread crumb as is. I think that's where I started
00:28:20
putting it together because I was like, I know, politics
00:28:24
change people and the spotlight. If it's on you and in your head
00:28:30
is just blowing up thinking about all the possibilities for
00:28:33
your future. It's very easy to forget the
00:28:36
people who helped you get there and the ones who made that
00:28:38
possible, but something told me the real Bryce Ridgeway.
00:28:43
He wouldn't be so quick to toss her out, he was set up to be
00:28:45
such a noble patriotic person. And the ideal Congressman that
00:28:50
we all need right now. And so when he tossed her aside,
00:28:54
I was thinking I'm like, I know politics kurup's.
00:28:58
But I think what I needed in Bryce Ridgeway was a stand-up
00:29:01
guy who wouldn't be corrupted by it.
00:29:04
And so the reveal was even more sweet because I knew my brace,
00:29:08
the real prize, the real right wouldn't have done that.
00:29:10
Yeah, exactly. Do we need a Bryce Ridgeway?
00:29:16
Did you have any thought in your mind that this character?
00:29:19
The real one is someone you'd vote for or someone?
00:29:24
We should have. Yeah, he's someone I'd like to
00:29:25
have no doubt about it. Yeah, definitely.
00:29:28
And I, yeah, and I know you always hear about the
00:29:32
not-so-great people in politics but there's some good ones.
00:29:36
I really believe there are some good ones out there but they
00:29:39
don't stand out, they don't make the news because you know,
00:29:42
they're doing the right thing. They're doing their job or
00:29:44
staying out of trouble and you know, it's easy to lose track of
00:29:47
that, but I think there are some good people in it.
00:29:50
Yeah, and that's what I was thinking of, before with the
00:29:52
Vince Flynn connection. Is that a Hallmark of his books
00:29:57
was the scumbags on Capitol Hill and always has villains are
00:30:01
secondary. Villains were in bed with these
00:30:03
politicians, right? And so Bryce made me think of
00:30:06
Michael O'Rourke and early, Vince Flynn character, who is a
00:30:10
congressman, who didn't care. He didn't care about politics,
00:30:14
even the president calling him up as a freshman, Congressman,
00:30:17
trying to tell him to vote for his budget.
00:30:20
It didn't work on him, you know, he said I'm going to do what's
00:30:22
best for my constituents and I feel like that's something Bryce
00:30:25
originally would have done. So it's kind of cool seeing
00:30:28
these characters we Pine for in fiction books.
00:30:33
Yeah. Yeah.
00:30:34
Ask you to bring up the vents plan?
00:30:36
What do you think? Kyle's Kyle, semi-retire and
00:30:39
while he's retiring from the Sears Don got they come over.
00:30:43
That's a that's a major thing. I mean that's those are big
00:30:46
shoes to fill. I think Donald's going to do a
00:30:48
good job. Yeah, I gotta say Chris and I
00:30:52
we're grappling with it. We're working through it.
00:30:54
Yeah, obviously we'll miss Kyle but you know when when Kyle took
00:31:00
it over everybody was not I don't know he's not going to be
00:31:03
that plan and that he took it over you know everybody loves
00:31:07
what he's doing with it. So yeah I think it's gonna work
00:31:10
out. And we owe that to Don Bentley,
00:31:13
right? Like there's no reason or
00:31:15
indication that he's not going to just run with this thing and
00:31:19
do justice to Vince. And, you know, pick up the
00:31:22
mantle from that Kyle left. And yeah, I think we have to
00:31:25
come at it with an open mind and hey, more my trap, I'll take
00:31:30
more, Mitch wrap right? So yeah, I'm curious, we haven't
00:31:35
asked any author about this but where you kind of shocked by
00:31:38
that. Is it something you would
00:31:40
understand when Or writing, or you're a steward of someone
00:31:43
else's universe, that you are kind of Yearning to go back to
00:31:46
your own roots and storytelling. Yeah, I mean, I've never been
00:31:51
asked to do that. I considered it.
00:31:53
Never pursued it, you know, looking at it from Kyle's point
00:31:57
of view, he's been doing met wrap a long time.
00:31:59
He has a lot of his own books about there and I'm sure he has
00:32:02
a lot of his own ideas like to pursue.
00:32:04
And, you know, at this point is, you know, made a name for
00:32:07
himself and he can do that. So, I'm not surprised You know,
00:32:12
David up. There's no certainly a lot of
00:32:14
pressure with that. It's hard.
00:32:16
Like, I do Mark Cameron did the Clancy thing and he was doing
00:32:19
one of his own book, so he's doing two books a year and
00:32:21
that's that's hard to do to really do well, so that's it.
00:32:25
Just kept our Kyle's just kept it to the one, you know that
00:32:28
traffic looking here and not done his own stuff for a long
00:32:31
time. So no, I'm not surprised.
00:32:33
He's, you know, taking a break and going off and doing his own
00:32:36
stuff. I think he he should, I think he
00:32:39
wants to I think he's earned that I stood on, you know, I
00:32:43
think I was going to do fine. I think we got to give me a
00:32:46
chance. I think he's going to do great.
00:32:48
Yeah. And also I'm curious to hear how
00:32:51
he'll balance the now 3 Series. Yeah.
00:32:54
That he's doing well. He may not do a multiple.
00:32:57
I mean, I can only do so much, they drop part of that, right?
00:33:01
A Feeling he'll do his own service but you know what you
00:33:04
should try and do some time after it may be near before.
00:33:08
After this next one comes out, Kurt Brett is You get both those
00:33:12
guys on the show, get them to talk about that.
00:33:15
You know, I'd really like that. Yeah, I'm going to reach out.
00:33:18
Simon shoestring David. I'd be a whole lot of fun to get
00:33:20
enough to get him on the same time.
00:33:22
Yeah, it really really would like that.
00:33:24
I think after Code Red makes sense.
00:33:26
Things might settle down a little bit.
00:33:28
Yeah, I'll transition. I'd be the perfect time after
00:33:31
code Bradford realization. And that's one thing we actually
00:33:35
said on one of our episodes were reflecting on this, this news
00:33:40
was, where is code red going to leave the universe?
00:33:44
We're moving on from the cooks, the presidential Administration
00:33:47
disc. I'll try to craft a new one that
00:33:49
Don has to accept, or does he leave a blank canvas to make a
00:33:52
president? And, you know, someone like
00:33:54
Irene, Kennedy spy Master disc. I'll decide what she does.
00:33:59
Because she's torn between private sector or public sector,
00:34:02
or even retirement. I'm a better throw some grenades
00:34:05
and his way I couldn't I think he's gonna leave a blank canvas
00:34:08
so I think code red is going to be a great book, but I am
00:34:11
curious about how much you try to advance Ants versus how much
00:34:15
you leave the door open. Yeah, we'll see.
00:34:18
We'll see. Yeah, that'd be fun to get the
00:34:20
two of them on. Will definitely have them both
00:34:22
on. I wonder if we can schedule it
00:34:23
together. Good suggestion there.
00:34:26
I bet they'd be amenable to it. I'm sure we'd have some good
00:34:29
laughs to. I'm sure, you know, we had a
00:34:32
good time with Brad Thor. Have you ever dealt with Brad?
00:34:35
We had a great. Oh, no, Brad no.
00:34:37
When I don't know. Okay, yeah, he was a whole lot
00:34:41
of fun and I mean, we're also on our season to going through the
00:34:45
Scott Harvest Series, so we love some David Slaton, we love some
00:34:50
Mitch wrap, some Scott harv at even James Reese.
00:34:53
Do you have more plans for a standalone book like this?
00:34:56
Do you see a second-price Ridgeway story or even his wife
00:35:00
story? Because she's the main
00:35:01
character, this was always a standalone discuss with the
00:35:04
thing. The way it ended price T.
00:35:06
I really want to just kind of make it a one month of deal
00:35:09
that's that, okay, right. So I Another slave book coming
00:35:13
out after that, I'm talking to the publisher.
00:35:16
May start a new series haven't quite got my Lancer out of here,
00:35:19
but it's possible. I'm going to start something
00:35:21
new. Similar to the slaves here, he's
00:35:24
okay. All right, very interesting.
00:35:27
I also noticed, your website mentioned an option with Amber
00:35:31
entertainment. Is there any movement on?
00:35:34
Yeah, that's, that's that expired.
00:35:36
I there was option for series was option for film while back,
00:35:40
it came very close to actually Being down over France, and of
00:35:46
all things that was scuttled by a terrorist attack.
00:35:49
It was once it was one signature away from being filmed over in
00:35:53
Paris, and it was back when they had that a terrorist attack on a
00:35:57
theater in Paris about eight, nine years ago.
00:35:59
Really, and the French got and it was this and bm6 but there's
00:36:03
the French. BBC is the French national film
00:36:05
are and they said oh I don't think we want to film a movie
00:36:08
about terrorism and Paris right now so they backed out of it.
00:36:12
Oh wow. Gee.
00:36:14
Yeah that sounds like a story line from a bit.
00:36:18
Yeah a little Poetic Justice. I guess terrorism Thrillers
00:36:23
shining on my Terrace. Wow.
00:36:26
Well anything else you want to tell us about deep fake?
00:36:29
We do recommend everyone. Pick this book up.
00:36:32
Obviously if you're still here you most likely have because now
00:36:35
you know the story, but anything else you want readers to know
00:36:39
going into deep fake? I'm just really looking forward
00:36:41
to hearing what people I'll think and getting the book out
00:36:44
there another week or so. What an incredible idea.
00:36:48
I mean, who knows? Maybe there's a politician out
00:36:50
there right now. Who's a deep fake.
00:36:52
We wouldn't even know it. Thanks Ward for talking to us.
00:36:57
We always love having you on and we hope to bring you back once
00:37:00
assassins. Mark is out later this year,
00:37:02
I'll be here. Thanks a lot, Mike.
00:37:08
All right, we need to thank our patrons.
00:37:10
Which Speaking of patrons for less than the price of a novel,
00:37:14
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00:37:18
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00:37:21
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00:37:25
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00:37:31
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00:37:38
You can find us at the other pod.com or on Twitter and
00:37:41
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00:37:46
there you go. And as always Fly, Southwest one
00:37:50
day, I'm going to hear Ward come over, you know, the PA on a
00:37:53
flight. I'm just going to lose my mind.